zlacker

[parent] [thread] 80 comments
1. p4bl0+(OP)[view] [source] 2025-01-13 18:51:26
> Twitter, which was arguably the hub of wokeness

This is a fake news. Research shows that Twitter algorithmic amplification favored right-wing politics even before Musk made it even worse. See: https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2025334119

> On the other hand, the people on the far left have only themselves to blame; they could tilt Twitter back to the left tomorrow if they wanted to.

Being this much clueless in pg's position is not possible. I can only assume he's consciously lying. He can see front row what Musk does with Twitter and how the "free speech" he's supposedly defending is actually "what Musk likes to hear speech", and he perfectly knows Musk is strongly aligned with the far right that he supports however he can all over the world. See for example: https://www.lemonde.fr/en/europe/article/2025/01/10/musk-dou...

replies(8): >>jirikn+15 >>vessen+I5 >>650RED+h6 >>jrm4+W8 >>logicc+n9 >>spinac+Nb >>jadbox+Hd >>normal+mg
2. jirikn+15[view] [source] 2025-01-13 19:11:47
>>p4bl0+(OP)
Can you prove it? Do you have any proof that Twitter promotes right leaning views more than left leaning ones?

"When You’re Accustomed to Privilege, Equality Feels Like Oppression"

Twitter was discriminating against right leaning views. Extreme far left views (like communism) were absolutely OK and widespread on Twitter. If one had as extreme right leaning views, he would be shadowbanned, reprioritised etc.

What is Twitter now is a fair game. Every voice is heard the same. What Twitter is doing now should have been the norm the whole time.

And the same is true for all major social networks, search engines, public funded media, universities and other organizations. When only leftists get their voice heard, they got used to it. Loosing this privilege looks like discrimination, doesn't it?

replies(4): >>650RED+G6 >>LeafIt+b7 >>apsec1+L7 >>blactu+5b
3. vessen+I5[view] [source] 2025-01-13 19:14:16
>>p4bl0+(OP)
Sorry, can you back this up with some data and specificity?

I understand that you feel Musk is aligned with the far right; my question is what exactly is Musk doing with twitter, and (other than when people take the piss against him personally) how is he removing free speech that is not "far right"?

I'm genuinely interested in the details -- and they are hard to come by.

replies(12): >>snotro+T7 >>aaomid+h8 >>suzzer+Q8 >>lostdo+U8 >>mempko+a9 >>threat+k9 >>blactu+P9 >>jrflow+Aa >>p4bl0+Ha >>weare1+Ta >>hmmm-i+Ui >>n4r9+yT5
4. 650RED+h6[view] [source] 2025-01-13 19:16:09
>>p4bl0+(OP)
I was banned from Twitter within hours of Elon having control for changing my displayed name (not my handle) to "Elon's Musk" in a reply to something unhinged that he had tweeted.

So much free speech.

replies(3): >>MrMcCa+e7 >>jack_r+F7 >>likeab+69
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5. 650RED+G6[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:17:37
>>jirikn+15
"What is Twitter now is a fair game. Every voice is heard the same. What Twitter is doing now should have been the norm the whole time."

Where is your proof for that being true? I was a left-leaning voice that was banned from Twitter after changing my display name (not handle) to "Elon's Musk".

How is that free speech?

replies(1): >>Cumpil+V7
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6. LeafIt+b7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:19:30
>>jirikn+15
Are you aware you are asking parent to “prove it” to the claims you don’t agree with, and then make similar claims in the opposite direction without “proving it”?
replies(3): >>Cumpil+F8 >>timsch+za >>jirikn+Ue
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7. MrMcCa+e7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:19:42
>>650RED+h6
The easiest thing for a truly evil person to do is lie. They lie about being good, first and foremost. That most people are just a bunch of willfully ignorant rubes works very well for them, unfortunately.
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8. jack_r+F7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:21:39
>>650RED+h6
So you were banned for the new rules on imitation as opposed to free speech
replies(4): >>hmmm-i+N7 >>ColdTa+O7 >>4ndrew+X7 >>650RED+na
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9. apsec1+L7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:22:19
>>jirikn+15
Based on looking at the "Latest" feed (which shouldn't be biased by the algorithm), and on what newly created accounts see, right-wing posts on Twitter outnumber left-wing posts something like 10:1.
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10. hmmm-i+N7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:22:31
>>jack_r+F7
That sounds like satire not imitation to me.
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11. ColdTa+O7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:22:33
>>jack_r+F7
This is clearly not an imitation. Parody if nothing else which is protected by fair use.
replies(1): >>qqqult+L9
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12. snotro+T7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:22:57
>>vessen+I5
> you feel Musk is aligned with the far right

It's not a feel, it's real (unless you're so far to the right yourself, you don't consider the AfD, neo-nazis, TERFs, etc etc such)

replies(1): >>Compos+tk
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13. Cumpil+V7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:23:07
>>650RED+G6
You got banned for impersonation, not speech.
replies(2): >>tricer+59 >>exe34+o9
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14. 4ndrew+X7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:23:09
>>jack_r+F7
"free speech absolutist"
replies(2): >>4ndrew+3k >>Levitz+Ry
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15. aaomid+h8[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:23:53
>>vessen+I5
Elevating tweets of folks that pay the troll under the bridge, where folks on the left are going to avoid that fee (why would someone on the left materially support a right wing pundit?) is one very obvious way.
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16. Cumpil+F8[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:24:53
>>LeafIt+b7
People gave Elon a lot of shit over his comments on supporting H1B visas and those comments weren't banned or deleted. There's your proof.
replies(1): >>aSanch+8a
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17. suzzer+Q8[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:25:47
>>vessen+I5
He tweeted 150x a day in support of Trump leading up to the election. Just go look at his timeline.

Edit: lol at this getting downvoted. Some of you free speech purists really don't want to hear basic facts. Seriously. Just go look at the timeline. 150x a day is not an exaggeration. All of it in direct support of Trump, or attacking DEI and anything else associated with Democrats.

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18. lostdo+U8[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:25:55
>>vessen+I5
I use Twitter for machine learning research only, but somehow that account gets inundated with Maga crap. That's proof enough for me.

Sure, that's an anecdote of one instance, but it's so clear. And how would you do a proper study? I'm guessing you would need Elon's permission.

19. jrm4+W8[view] [source] 2025-01-13 19:26:02
>>p4bl0+(OP)
I wish, but to be Black in America is to witness this sort of cluelessness (despite prowess in other areas) ALL THE TIME.

Domain specific knowledge is SO REAL.

(Incidentally, this is roughly why I don't believe we will ever have so called "AGI")

replies(1): >>sangno+lc
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20. tricer+59[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:26:44
>>Cumpil+V7
> for impersonation

Of a cologne brand of some kind? "Elon's Musk" is very clearly not a person.

replies(2): >>Cumpil+R9 >>logicc+3a
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21. likeab+69[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:26:45
>>650RED+h6
Were you banned for your speech or for being a troll intent on being disruptive to the community? Because there's a difference.
replies(2): >>ziml77+Za >>echelo+pb
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22. mempko+a9[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:26:53
>>vessen+I5
Create a new account and find out. If you create a new account, without any other information, twitter will recommend you follow Musk, Don Jr (President's right wing son), and Babylong Bee, a right wing fake news joke site.

Go ahead, do the experiment and come back and tell me what you see.

replies(1): >>ziml77+La
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23. threat+k9[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:27:17
>>vessen+I5
Elon suspended PG's account just for lightly alluding that another social media platform exists. I'm not sure why you're even bringing up the idea of free speech on Twitter. Can you imagine Discord suspending your account for lightly alluding that Slack exists?
replies(2): >>vessen+ob >>notaha+Mc
24. logicc+n9[view] [source] 2025-01-13 19:27:31
>>p4bl0+(OP)
Musk recently de-verified or banned a bunch of far-right accounts that were posting anti-H1B content. Musk isn't far right, he's just looking after his business interests.
replies(2): >>aSanch+vb >>p4bl0+bd
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25. exe34+o9[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:27:39
>>Cumpil+V7
Nobody would confuse "Elon's Musk" with Elon Musk.
replies(1): >>Cumpil+4y1
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26. qqqult+L9[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:29:04
>>ColdTa+O7
The imitation rule states that it's perfectly fine to run parody accounts as long as you clearly state that it's a parody. There are a ton of accounts named Elon Musk Parody, Biden Parody and similar

Without it every post of a famous person was botted with 100 accounts with identical display name, pfp that tried to promote scams like with YouTube comments

replies(2): >>ColdTa+eb >>lern_t+cf
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27. blactu+P9[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:29:22
>>vessen+I5
I can. Before he owned twitter, if someone called me the n-word or other racial slurs, action was taken. Now when that happens and I report it, they reply to tell me no rules were broken
replies(1): >>vessen+vc
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28. Cumpil+R9[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:29:24
>>tricer+59
"Joe's Rogan" is also not a person, but plenty of bots and scammers on social media use such celebrity names to obfuscate their accounts and scam people with crypto/erection pills, etc. You have to ban all of them to eliminate scammers as much as possible.
replies(1): >>tricer+ag
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29. logicc+3a[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:30:10
>>tricer+59
It's an actual cologne one can buy: https://www.joketown.com/smell-rich
replies(1): >>tricer+7e
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30. aSanch+8a[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:30:21
>>Cumpil+F8
Actually many people on the right believe they have been censored by Musk because of this: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/08/technology/elon-musk-far-...
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31. 650RED+na[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:30:49
>>jack_r+F7
How is that imitation?
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32. timsch+za[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:31:19
>>LeafIt+b7
I believe he's referring to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twitter_Files
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33. jrflow+Aa[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:31:25
>>vessen+I5
If your position is that awareness of Musk’s alignment with the far right is a matter of feeling rather than well-documented fact [1,2,3,4,5,6,7] then no amount of easily-accessible and readily-available detail will convince you to adjust that position.

As for an example of Elon making Twitter rules around speech he doesn’t like, here[8] is one that is very public and not hard to come by.

1 https://techcrunch.com/2022/12/02/elon-musk-nazis-kanye-twit...

2 https://www.forbes.com/sites/antoniopequenoiv/2024/12/20/elo...

3 https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/08/technology/elon-musk-far-...

4 https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-news/elon-musk-...

5 https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/23/business/elon-musk-nazi-jokes...

6 https://www.nydailynews.com/2024/05/02/elon-musk-reinstates-...

7 https://www.vice.com/en/article/elon-musk-twitter-nazis-whit...

8 https://gizmodo.com/elon-musk-cis-cisgender-slur-twitter-185...

replies(1): >>vessen+ge
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34. p4bl0+Ha[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:31:59
>>vessen+I5
This is by Twitter itself, before Musk: "Our results reveal a remarkably consistent trend: In six out of seven countries studied, the mainstream political right enjoys higher algorithmic amplification than the mainstream political left." https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2025334119

This is more recent: "We observe a right-leaning bias in exposure for new accounts within their default timelines." https://arxiv.org/abs/2411.01852

You can also find a lot a testimony from users like: https://www.reddit.com/r/behindthebastards/comments/1es2lfd/...

---

Now from personal experience (I've been on Twitter since 2007 and used it virtually everyday since then):

I've heard and read a lot of such testimony in particular from user who don't post much or at all and only follow a few accounts. In the last two years they've been exposed to a lot of far right content.

I've seen how the moderation team at twitter took action before musk when reporting (often illegal) hate speech and now just respond by saying that it doesn't violates the platform rules.

I've seen on the contrary people (even journalists) and political or news organization getting locked out of their account following a far right online mob against them, and then having a hard time (sometimes to the point of giving up) getting it back because the moderation team did not act.

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35. ziml77+La[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:32:03
>>mempko+a9
You don't even need a new account. You could have a years old account and you'll get notifications about that crap even if you have never followed anything even remotely similar. That's what made me delete my account. I got Musk's tweets in my notifications and noped the fuck out.
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36. weare1+Ta[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:32:17
>>vessen+I5
Just go check out that man's X (twitter?) feed. Elon constantly says the quiet part out loud. I'm from genx and if you're younger I'm going to give you all some solid life advice. When someone tells you who they are, listen.
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37. ziml77+Za[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:32:38
>>likeab+69
Shouldn't matter. Musk is a free speech absolutist after all.
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38. blactu+5b[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:33:02
>>jirikn+15
Bullshit. Try using the term cisgender on Twitter, regardless of context
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39. ColdTa+eb[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:33:33
>>qqqult+L9
The user says they were banned within hours of Elon taking over Twitter. New Parody rules did not come into affect until November 2022.
replies(1): >>qqqult+sf
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40. vessen+ob[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:34:17
>>threat+k9
I do not call that a censorship of speech decision, it's a banning encouraging the competition decision, no? The company doesn't want competitors being boosted, so it makes and enforces a policy. I presume people discussing the Fediverse as a concept are not routinely suspended, although I'm too lazy to check.
replies(1): >>threat+Fe
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41. echelo+pb[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:34:17
>>likeab+69
In this case, they are one in the same. And if it is a free speech forum, then it should have been a protected act.

Free speech means free speech for those you dislike too. It also means having a space for those that are disruptive, loud, and engaging in trolling. That's what those fire-and-brimstone "you're going to hell" preachers are doing at universities. (Which isn't all bad - it gives students a great opportunity to learn debate and to stand up for what they believe in.)

The ACLU has represented the Vietnam War protestors, the KKK, neo-Nazis, LGBT activists, Westboro Baptist Church members, religious followers of Jerry Falwell, flag burners, anti-abortion activists, women's rights activists, communist party members, gun rights advocates, anti-Trump protestors, BLM protestors, and more. And it's a good thing they represented every single one, because erosion of free speech for those we don't like will eventually get back to us.

replies(1): >>likeab+ct
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42. aSanch+vb[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:34:48
>>logicc+n9
Well like any political descriptor, "far right" is a generalization that applies to several groups. In this case, Elon is part of the corporate-techno-authoritarian far right that supported trump, while figures like Loomer who were posting the anti-H1B content are part of the white-nationalist/christian-nationalist far right (that also supported trump).
43. spinac+Nb[view] [source] 2025-01-13 19:35:29
>>p4bl0+(OP)
People who lean left are choosing to leave.

Greg Lukianoff of FIRE, a free speech defender said Musk made twitter better for free speech (on balance): https://youtu.be/Er1glEAQhAo?si=2aWdSIsbKzjz0nGA&t=2853

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44. sangno+lc[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:37:17
>>jrm4+W8
Calling this "cluelessness" is being more charitable that parent, and on the balance of evidence, mayn not be the correct explanation.

If one were sceptical of this synchronized "political awakening" in the tech industry, that incidentally is aligned to an incoming presidential administration, one might call it some sort of gratuitous signaling of virtues. Which is hilariously ironic, and shows either a lack of self-awareness, or profound levels of shamelessness.

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45. vessen+vc[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:37:39
>>blactu+P9
I'm sorry to hear you're called slurs. They seem endemic for my kid as well as soon as you move out of ultra progressive areas; as a white parent of a black kid, it's disheartening and eye opening to find out just how racist some families are, and how immensely wide spread it is.

That said, I don't think this qualifies as newly minted removal of speech. It is the allowance of speech that was formerly removed.

replies(1): >>blactu+Xc
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46. notaha+Mc[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:38:49
>>threat+k9
That's a great example of the insincerity of the PG article. I mean, I can believe there are people that don't pay very much attention to Twitter who genuinely believe that Elon Musk is the sort of free speech absolutist he says he is, but someone who was suspended and then left Twitter because a new Elon censorship policy praising Elon for not censoring anyone is quite funny.
replies(1): >>vessen+2i
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47. blactu+Xc[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:39:37
>>vessen+vc
He does not allow the use of the word cisgender, in any context, for one
replies(2): >>dragon+ye >>vessen+pi
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48. p4bl0+bd[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:40:06
>>logicc+n9
Musk literally supports the far right in elections all over the world. In the past few days he intervened in Germany in favor of the far right candidate. See https://www.lemonde.fr/en/europe/article/2025/01/10/musk-dou...
49. jadbox+Hd[view] [source] 2025-01-13 19:42:06
>>p4bl0+(OP)
This feels like another VC/executive "taking a knee" towards the new administration, a vivid trend in the last few weeks. I feel like pg was particularly more left/right neutral just up until this month of inauguration.
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50. tricer+7e[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:43:17
>>logicc+3a
Never heard of it. Was the banned account flogging its own cologne with the same name?
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51. vessen+ge[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:43:42
>>jrflow+Aa
No, I didn't make any statement on Musk's politics; it wasn't the part of the comment that interested me.

To the extent you slightly implied you were interested in what I think, he certainly seems trending far-right to me, but I think you need to moderate any thoughts on Musk with the reminder that he loves the drama, enjoys trolling, and has an almost unique freedom (in the west) to say whatever he likes online. Combine that with the drugs and his current ego trip, and I don't think it's that easy to say what he actually thinks, and I certainly don't think it's worth a lot of my time to consider it deeply.

I agree that banning cis while allowing the n-word is a concrete example, thank you. Super dumb. Speaking as a cishet guy. Also, banning cis seems essentially performative for Musk's (target?) audience(s?) -- I note that anti-trans rhetoric was one of the major platform points for Republicans in this election, so it's not, like, risky performativism, just run of the mill performativism.

replies(1): >>jrflow+wo
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52. dragon+ye[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:44:46
>>blactu+Xc
This is so vigorous that the standalone term "cis", is frequently targeted for visibility reduction even when used outside of the context of gender.
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53. threat+Fe[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:45:03
>>vessen+ob
So you imagine Discord punishing you for talking about Slack? Or Google suspending your account for talking about TikTok? On the matter of customers talking about marketplace alternatives... your instincts say "oh yes, let's exclude this from the discussion of free speech?"
replies(1): >>vessen+Kh
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54. jirikn+Ue[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:45:57
>>LeafIt+b7
Easy, Reclaim The Net documents Twitter censorship for years. Here, you have dozens of links, pages and pages https://reclaimthenet.org/?s=twitter
replies(1): >>tzs+aX
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55. lern_t+cf[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:46:59
>>qqqult+L9
Here's an account that calls itself Michelle Obama (not even Michelle's Obama) after the parody rule went into effect (unlike Elon's Musk). It doesn't label itself a parody. It's still there. https://x.com/TaxpayerEnrique
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56. qqqult+sf[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:47:43
>>ColdTa+eb
I replied to your comment about what constitutes imitation and why that rule exists. Neither of us have any idea about the details of that particular ban
replies(1): >>ColdTa+Gg
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57. tricer+ag[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:50:36
>>Cumpil+R9
> use such celebrity names to obfuscate their accounts

I thought free speech and sunlight were the best disinfectants. By leaving these accounts up and allowing other users to point out how they were misleading, everyone will learn and be wiser.

58. normal+mg[view] [source] 2025-01-13 19:51:17
>>p4bl0+(OP)
It’s interesting to see how polarizing views about Musk have become. People often overlook the fact that Musk was, and in many ways still is, aligned with traditional liberal values. He’s been a long-time supporter of initiatives like universal basic income, environmental sustainability through the green movement ect... Yet, the moment he expresses support for ideas that deviate from the more extreme edges of left-wing ideology, he’s vilified and treated as a pariah by those who once championed him.

Regarding X, I still see plenty of left-leaning content, but the dynamic has undoubtedly shifted. What’s changed is that the platform no longer artificially amplifies one ideological perspective at the expense of others. Previously, algorithms seemed to prioritize content aligned with extreme left narratives while outright blocking opposing views. That system gave the impression of a dominant left-leaning consensus, that was entirely artificial.

At the end of the day, it's impossible to remove all bias so whatever system maximizes free speech is the best one.

replies(1): >>p4bl0+Sh
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59. ColdTa+Gg[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:52:07
>>qqqult+sf
I know why the rule exist. Getting banned for a rule that did not exist at the time is an overreach from a self-proclaimed free speech absolutist.
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60. vessen+Kh[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:55:53
>>threat+Fe
Nope, I don't imagine this because those companies make different promises to their users than X does to its. They, none of them, are part of the commons of US discourse, embedded in our infrastructure. They'd have to be universal or nearly so to even qualify for most definitions of the way the word 'censorship' applies under the US 1st amendment.

I don't take my business to Twitter, and that's fine. I choose to use Discord because, in very small part, I guess, of its attitude on content. Google would no doubt ban me for some sorts of content, but not most. Again, these are business decisions that any of these companies can make; some will lose them users (money), some will gain, that's all fine with me; they'll (generally) adjust to making the most money, e.g. serving the most economically large portion of their user base they can attract.

Musk's a wild card because he can (mostly) afford to pay extra to get a different mix of users than might be totally economically optimal, but history shows that most significant and impactful companies trend hard toward serving their customer base and trying to expand it as widely as possible.

Free speech is alive and well in the US; I can publish a website with nearly anything I want to say on it, and if it's taken down, I am allowed access to Federal courts to determine if that takedown was legal. I can email it, I can print it on broadsheets and distribute it anywhere I want, I can text it out en-masse. I cannot say whatever I want on a Disney forum, however, and that, like Twitter does not impact the question of whether or not we have free speech.

replies(1): >>jadbox+Zv
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61. p4bl0+Sh[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:56:24
>>normal+mg
What are you saying? Musk is literally and openly supporting the far right neo-nazi party in Germany these days. See: https://www.lemonde.fr/en/europe/article/2025/01/10/musk-dou...

Also, it's just not true that "Previously, algorithms seemed to prioritize content aligned with extreme left narratives while outright blocking opposing views". It's a lie. Twitter's research itself revealed their algorithm favored right wing politics even before Musk. And it became a lot more true since he took power. See: https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2025334119

replies(1): >>normal+3B
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62. vessen+2i[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:57:16
>>notaha+Mc
... Or he is well placed to make an even-handed assessment? If your prior is that people generally are smart and have agency, it seems like you might not want to discard pg's opinion out of hand.

Agreed that Elon doesn't seem to be as much of a free speech absolutist as he promised, especially if you hurt his feelings, or seem fun to ban.

replies(1): >>notaha+Wr
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63. vessen+pi[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 19:58:52
>>blactu+Xc
Yep, this was mentioned elsewhere in this thread, and it's the only example I've heard of. Like I said elsewhere, seems performative to me.
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64. hmmm-i+Ui[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:00:36
>>vessen+I5
Its interesting how doing something is immediately equated with 'removing not far right' free speech.

The idea is he promotes the talking points that benefit the right and the Republicans. Both personally and in changing the platforms algorithms [1].

There have been reports of people disagreeing with that general 'platform' loosing their blue check marks [2], accounts being disabled, followers dropped [3] and so on to reduce the reach of left/liberal people.

He doesn't need to remove speech he disagrees with, he can drown it and amplify the messages he wants to be heard and significantly control the narrative and discussion that way.

[1]https://eprints.qut.edu.au/253211/1/A_computational_analysis...

[2]https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/elon-musk-accused-...

[3]https://finance.yahoo.com/news/big-twitter-accounts-left-los...

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65. 4ndrew+3k[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:05:01
>>4ndrew+X7
presumably downvoted because a) every time you mention 'free speech' to these techbro nutjobs it's clear they don't have the first idea what it actually means b) insecure snowflakes, every one of them.
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66. Compos+tk[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:06:44
>>snotro+T7
TERFs (trans-exclusionary radical feminists) are generally left-wing, despite holding a reactionary view on trans people. That sort of comes with the territory of being a radical feminist. If someone is right-wing, or even just a centrist liberal feminist, then they're just an ordinary transphobe, not a TERF.
replies(2): >>jadbox+un >>snotro+Yu
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67. jadbox+un[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:19:05
>>Compos+tk
While you may be right by academic classification, most TERF studies I've seen and most notable TERF accounts on X are almost exclusively far right-wing, because it is an inherently conservative stance even if the grounding starting position is more socially progressive.
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68. jrflow+wo[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:22:25
>>vessen+ge
> I think you need to moderate any thoughts on Musk

The idea that forming an opinion about somebody based on what they publicly repeatedly say and do over the course of years is somehow the wrong approach with This One Guy is an act of unnecessary and unjustified generosity. “Loving the drama” is not in any way exclusive to having actual opinions, and trolls are not magical beings that exist in an inscrutable superposition of possible realities that they may or may not support.

It is downright silly when someone’s conduct is so clear that the only way to defend them is to handwave away everything that they say and do and retreat into the philosophical ideal of the unknowability of a man’s heart. That is an academic exercise that’s only useful in analyzing fictional characters and has negative value when applied to real-life powerful people that fund politicians and buy social media sites to forcibly mold public discussion to fit their values.

replies(1): >>vessen+Or
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69. vessen+Or[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:33:37
>>jrflow+wo
I'm not defending Mr. Musk at all. I'm saying it's pointless to spend more than 0.0001% of my time or brainpower thinking about him and his politics -- a COMPLETE waste of time exceeded perhaps only by reading his Tweets, be they heartfelt or performative or trolling. To the extent I'm thinking about Elon, I'm thinking about what led to his success, and how those lessons might apply to me or people I'm supporting.
replies(1): >>jrflow+WA
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70. notaha+Wr[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:34:07
>>vessen+2i
Well if we agree that Elon's regime is pretty ban-happy (his own published data agrees too), I don't see how we come to the conclusion that a statement praising Elon for making Twitter "neutral" and "without censorship" after literally seeing his posts censored under Elon policy is an "even handed assessment". It's precisely because I think PG is smart and has agency that I assume he's someone that's aware of obvious benefits to ingratiating himself with the new regime rather than oblivious to how Elon actually runs the place.
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71. likeab+ct[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:39:22
>>echelo+pb
The most ardent tattletales from pre-Musk Twitter, angry that their sandbox has been opened up, have now co-opted the free speech argument to act like complete assholes. They're not one and the same.

To those I suggest they move on to BlueSky, where the preshared blacklists and ability to inform on others they despise would be more to their liking.

Alternatively, they could go touch grass.

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72. snotro+Yu[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:46:21
>>Compos+tk
TERFs outed themselves as exclusionary. As such, they can't be left wing, even if they would like to align with it on some other principles. You can't be humanistic only towards some humans.
replies(1): >>terfy+tN1
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73. jadbox+Zv[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 20:49:34
>>vessen+Kh
Publishing a website is about as good as writing a book and dropping it off in an alley trashcan. You may have a voice but you won't be given volume or oxygen. X actively drops visibility for posts linking to external sites, and bot generated blogs are polluting Google so badly that you have no luck for organic reach.

Free speech requires public spaces [digital townhalls], but any journalist breaking critical news of Musk gets muted or banned on X. [https://thespectator.com/topic/spectator-story-debunking-elo...]. This is why several major global journal outlets have taken to just entirely leaving X in protest [https://www.cjr.org/the_media_today/journalists_leaving_x_bl...].

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74. Levitz+Ry[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 21:00:19
>>4ndrew+X7
Free speech is the freedom to communicate ideas and opinions. The above censors none.

This is also why spam is not covered under freedom of speech.

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75. jrflow+WA[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 21:07:56
>>vessen+Or
Saying “we don’t know what he actually thinks” is a defense. You only ever see people use that line when it comes to his politics, but never say, to question whether he actually likes Diablo 4 or AI.

When it comes to things that people find mundane or agreeable, the stuff he posts about all day reflects what he thinks but when he gives fifty million dollars to Stephen Miller[1] in 2022 to fund his Citizens for Sanity ads[2], maybe he’s trolling or it’s drugs or whatever.

> I'm thinking about what led to his success, and how those lessons might apply to me or people I'm supporting.

This is quite literally a defense of his character. If your response to “this guy sucks, here is proof that this guy sucks” is “there is literally nothing bad he could do that justifies thinking about anything other than the positives about him”, that is what defending a person looks like.

1

https://thehill.com/policy/technology/4912754-musk-donated-m...

2

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2022/11/who-is-behind-citize...

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76. normal+3B[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 21:08:35
>>p4bl0+Sh
While at the same time our tax dollars are supporting literal Nazis in the Ukraine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Brigade

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77. tzs+aX[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-13 23:02:55
>>jirikn+Ue
The contention you are trying to challenge is that Twitter amplified right wing posts more than left wing posts in the pre-Musk days.

Your link fails to support you. It is mostly just examples of alleged Twitter censorship, mostly of right wing-ish stuff. This has a couple of problems.

First, the claim was about what Twitter amplified, not what it censored. It is quite possible to both amplify a given type of post more and censor that type of post more. It is possible that censorship might inversely correlate with amplification so that one can be used as an inverse proxy for the other, but that would require research because it is also possible they correlate rather than inverse correlate. Something amplified draws more readers, which could increase the likelihood that someone will notice any violations of the rules and report it.

Second, even if we make the assumption of an inverse correlation between censorship and amplification to see how left and right amplification compares we would need to know how they picked which incidents to write stories about.

Reclaim the Net does not provide any information on who funds it or who runs it, it is asking for donations but doesn't say what the donations are used for. The names listed on it don't show up in search except at RTN or on sites that are reprinting RTN stories. There is just not enough information available as far as I could find to tell what biases they have when selecting stories.

The commenter you asked for proof cites a published paper in a peer reviewed open access journal that gives a detailed explanation of how it reached its conclusions. Its authors include several people who worked at Twitter and had access to its internal data.

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78. Cumpil+4y1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-14 03:05:20
>>exe34+o9
You're clueless of the real world if you think nobody falls for that. There wouldn't be any scammers if that would be the case.
replies(1): >>exe34+Y43
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79. terfy+tN1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-14 05:21:49
>>snotro+Yu
We're "exclusionary" in the sense that we want males be excluded from spaces intended for women and girls, yes. This is entirely compatible with left-wing political views.

Really, this should be uncontroversial.

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80. exe34+Y43[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-14 16:02:19
>>Cumpil+4y1
who needs scammers when you have the real Elon selling full self driving.
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81. n4r9+yT5[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-01-15 11:24:53
>>vessen+I5
> how is he removing free speech that is not "far right"

In Dec 2022 he suspended the accounts of several left-leaning journalists without providing a cohesive justification: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/12/15/technology/twitter-suspen...

Posting about Ukraine is categorised as misinformation and downranked: https://x.com/aakashg0/status/1641976925064245249

Suppression of tweets in India and Turkey: https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/twitter-takes-down-po... https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2023/05/twitter-musk-censors...

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