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1. afavou+(OP)[view] [source] 2024-09-13 15:12:47
The circle of life. People said the same thing about Playboy when it first came out, about Internet porn when it first came out… People have been “falling in love” with strippers for as long as strippers have existed. In many ways OF feels like a positive step because it allows the removal of toxic middlemen that stand between the model and their customer.

To my mind the bigger issue is how much of it is a total scam. OF models offshoring their DM responses so their clients think they’re having conversations with the model when it’s actually some dude half the world away. Or using AI for the same, which I’m sure is increasing exponentially.

It’s going to be interesting to see what happens when AI is able to generate on demand video/photo and chat that’s realistic enough to satisfy an online client. If people are specifically told it’s AI will they be content with that? Or will they still want an actual real human? We're not exactly rational creatures at the best of times so it’ll be fascinating to see. We’ll have gone from the phone sex lines of yore, where you are interacting with a real human even though they’re definitely not the human you’re imagining in your head, to an AI video chat where you’re seeing exactly what you want but there’s nothing behind it.

replies(7): >>ethbr1+j3 >>chongl+i7 >>deepsu+v7 >>menset+Pb >>Tyr42+ao >>codeAl+Mw >>golerg+jJ
2. ethbr1+j3[view] [source] 2024-09-13 15:34:38
>>afavou+(OP)
> OF models [...] using AI for [answering DM responses]

This seems like OF's Etsy trap moment.

On the one hand, scaling creator:individual_fan multiples via AI assisted messaging = $$$ (to creators and OF)

On the other hand, it canabalizes their core business value tenet -- authenticity.

It'll be curious to see which path they choose, and if it ends up playing out similar to Etsy. I.e. temporarily increasing their revenue while erroding their brand, then having to tack back once they realize how dire things have gotten in customers' eyes.

replies(2): >>mrgold+P5 >>naijab+Ym
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3. mrgold+P5[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-09-13 15:49:38
>>ethbr1+j3
Doing it with LLMs may be new but the idea of farming out the fan interaction to an army of gig workers plus automation is well established, including automation for suggested replies, keeping track of past interactions, etc.
4. chongl+i7[view] [source] 2024-09-13 15:59:45
>>afavou+(OP)
removal of toxic middlemen that stand between the model and their customer.

...

OF models offshoring their DM responses

I mean this sounds to me like the toxic middlemen have changed form, rather than gone away. Now the toxic middlemen work for the performer, rather than the other way around. But they're still toxic and their toxicity is now directed at the buyer instead.

5. deepsu+v7[view] [source] 2024-09-13 16:00:53
>>afavou+(OP)
I think people would still prefer "real" content, same way as they prefer live streams to recordings for some reason (hey, handpicked recordings are objectively better!). Same way as people want "real wood", and "real leather", even when there're objectively better alternatives.

That said, people only need to _believe_ it's real.

6. menset+Pb[view] [source] 2024-09-13 16:26:45
>>afavou+(OP)
Marriage rates are down nearly 80% and it matches exactly the decline of births. So the slippery slope did work on reducing population growth!
replies(1): >>afavou+j21
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7. naijab+Ym[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-09-13 17:41:01
>>ethbr1+j3
Embracing gen AI is absolutely the wrong move for a content creators. People are not paying for visuals and conversations. They are paying for a genuine human to human interaction. If you take away that part, you’re left with worthless pixels on a screen
replies(2): >>ethbr1+AJ >>tivert+3M
8. Tyr42+ao[view] [source] 2024-09-13 17:50:29
>>afavou+(OP)
You might be interested in the latent space podcast about using Ai to do exactly this, as compared to offshoring.

https://www.latent.space/p/nsfw-chatbots

9. codeAl+Mw[view] [source] 2024-09-13 18:52:34
>>afavou+(OP)
> In many ways OF feels like a positive step because it allows the removal of toxic middlemen that stand between the model and their customer.

Wait, are you intentionally ignoring the fact that OF is the middleman? Because it definitely is, making about 1 billion dollars off of 5 billion dollars of transactions. Or are you saying OF is a "good non-toxic middleman".

replies(2): >>afavou+A21 >>not2b+u31
10. golerg+jJ[view] [source] 2024-09-13 20:24:27
>>afavou+(OP)
I've explored using LLMs for this exact purpose, and there's a huge problem. Onlyfans rules very strictly forbid incest and other kinds of icky content, and Onlyfans sexters are very, very aware of this. If you break the rules, Onlyfans is very eager with permabans, and getting your account banned effectively destroys your whole business.

When it's that easy to screw up, it's easier and cheaper to pay real humans $1k a month for sexting than to build an LLM-based system that never makes mistakes and is 100% secured against prompt injection.

replies(1): >>HappMa+831
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11. ethbr1+AJ[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-09-13 20:26:48
>>naijab+Ym
It's a weird set of game outcomes though.

If it's not done, then creators have a fundamental time cap to the amount of personalized content they can create.

If it's done, but users don't know about it, then creators increase their revenue several times.

If it's done, but users do know about it, then creators lose several multiples of revenue.

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12. tivert+3M[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-09-13 20:45:07
>>naijab+Ym
> Embracing gen AI is absolutely the wrong move for a content creators. People are not paying for visuals and conversations. They are paying for a genuine human to human interaction. If you take away that part, you’re left with worthless pixels on a screen

If people are going to a porn site to spend relatively small amounts of money to get "genuine human to human interaction," there are more than a few flaws in their strategy. Unless they're spending many thousands of dollars a month, there could be no reasonable expectation they're getting anything but extremely superficial interactions. If they get mad because they think they should get an e-girlfriend for $10 a month or whatever, I'd say that's on them because of unreasonable expectations.

Honestly, I think gen AI is pretty much inevitable for these kinds of parasocial services, but it will be clandestinely used because otherwise it makes perfect sense for the "content creator." Whatever relationship they think they have is an illusion in their head anyway, and they're probably expending a fair amount of energy to maintain it.

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13. afavou+j21[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-09-13 22:56:18
>>menset+Pb
I’d you’re suggesting marriage rates are down because of porn I’m going to throw a [citation needed] on there.
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14. afavou+A21[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-09-13 22:58:56
>>codeAl+Mw
I don’t know the ins and outs (pun intended) of Onlyfans but it certainly seems considerably less toxic than a lot of pornography producers, based on past stories I’ve read. If your numbers are correct a 20% take is orders of magnitude better than previous arrangements.
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15. HappMa+831[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-09-13 23:08:28
>>golerg+jJ
.. or gen the LLM content and have a human swipe away the rule-breaking content. .. and if you don't then whoever you farm out to will.
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16. not2b+u31[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-09-13 23:12:47
>>codeAl+Mw
If OnlyFans is taking a 20% cut and Apple is taking a 30% cut of transactions on their platform, it seems that Apple is 50% more toxic than OnlyFans.

I've never done business with them and am not interested in buying that kind of content, but it certainly seems like an improvement over any more traditional sex-related work for those who are interested in being in that market.

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