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[parent] [thread] 24 comments
1. gnulin+(OP)[view] [source] 2023-11-18 03:12:54
Haha yeah no I don't believe this. They're nowhere near AGI, even if it's possible at all to be there with the current tech we have, which is unconvincing. I don't believe professionals who work in biggest AI labs are spooked by GPT. I need more evidence to believe something like that sorry. It sounds a lot more like Sam Altman lied to the board.
replies(4): >>aidama+T2 >>cm2012+i3 >>spacem+j6 >>skwirl+t6
2. aidama+T2[view] [source] 2023-11-18 03:31:57
>>gnulin+(OP)
GPT 4 is not remotely unconvincing. It is clearly more intelligent than the average human, and is able to reason in the exact same way as humans. If you provide the steps to reason through any concecpt, it is able to understand at human capability.

GPT 4 is clearly AGI. All of the GPTs have shown general intelligence, but GPT 4 is human-level intelligence.

replies(6): >>SkyPun+B3 >>cscurm+e4 >>static+75 >>haolez+q5 >>lossol+A6 >>morsec+I6
3. cm2012+i3[view] [source] 2023-11-18 03:34:13
>>gnulin+(OP)
It's like a religion for these people.
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4. SkyPun+B3[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 03:36:32
>>aidama+T2
The only thing GPT 4 is missing is the ability to recognize it needs to ask more questions before it jumps into a problem.

When you compare it to an entry level data entry role, it's absolutely AGI. You loosely tell it what it needs to do, step-by-step, and it does it.

replies(1): >>dekhn+ed
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5. cscurm+e4[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 03:42:16
>>aidama+T2
Sorry. Robust research says no. Remember, people thought Eliza was AGI too.

https://arxiv.org/abs/2308.03762

If it was really AGI, there won't even be ambiguity and room for comments like mine.

replies(2): >>iamnot+67 >>Camper+79
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6. static+75[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 03:49:12
>>aidama+T2
Fascinating. What do you make of the fact GPT 4 says you have no clue what you are talking about?
replies(1): >>postal+k6
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7. haolez+q5[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 03:51:43
>>aidama+T2
I kind of agree, but at the same time we can't be sure of what's going on behind the scenes. It seems that GPT-4 is a combination of several huge models with some logic to route the requests to the most apt models. Maybe an AGI would make more sense as a single, more cohese structure?

Also, the fact that it can't incorporate knowledge at the same time as it interacts with us kind of limits the idea of an AGI.

But regardless, it's absurdly impressive what it can do today.

8. spacem+j6[view] [source] 2023-11-18 03:58:26
>>gnulin+(OP)
We barely understand the human brain, but sure we’re super close to AGI because we made chat bots that don’t completely suck anymore. It’s such hubris. Are the tools cool? Undoubtedly. But come down to earth for a second. People have lost all objectivity.
replies(2): >>MVisse+Va >>totall+Cb
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9. postal+k6[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 03:58:32
>>static+75
How does knowing you are arguing against a GPT-4 bot?
10. skwirl+t6[view] [source] 2023-11-18 03:59:47
>>gnulin+(OP)
>I don't believe professionals who work in biggest AI labs are spooked by GPT.

Then you haven't been paying any attention to them.

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11. lossol+A6[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 04:00:56
>>aidama+T2
Well, if it's so smart then maybe it will learn to count finally someday.

https://chat.openai.com/share/986f55d2-8a46-4b16-974f-840cb0...

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12. morsec+I6[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 04:01:27
>>aidama+T2
These models can't even form new memories beyond the length of their context windows. It's impressive but it is clearly not AGI.
replies(1): >>MVisse+jb
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13. iamnot+67[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 04:05:38
>>cscurm+e4
It’s not AGI. But I’m not convinced we need a single model that can reason to make super powerful general purpose AI. If you can have a model detect where it can’t reason and pass off tasks appropriately to better methods or domain specific models you can get very powerful results. OpenAI already on the path to doing this with GPT
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14. Camper+79[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 04:21:19
>>cscurm+e4
As if most humans would do any better on those exercises.

This thing is two years old. Be patient.

replies(2): >>cscurm+in >>smolde+Xz
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15. MVisse+Va[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 04:34:02
>>spacem+j6
Objectively speaking, we’re talking exponential growth in both compute and capabilities year over year.

Do you have any data that shows that we’ll plateau any time soon?

Because if this trend continues, we’ll have superhuman levels of compute within 5 years.

replies(1): >>spacem+Wi5
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16. MVisse+jb[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 04:36:36
>>morsec+I6
Neither can you without your short-term memory system. Or your long-term memory system in your hippocampus.

People that have lost those abilities still have human level of intelligence.

replies(1): >>morsec+Tf
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17. totall+Cb[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 04:38:29
>>spacem+j6
I've been watching this whole hype cycle completely horrified from the sidelines. Those early debates right here on HN with people genuinely worried about an LLM developing conscience and taking control of the world. Senior SWEs fearing for their jobs. And now we're just throwing the term AGI around like it's imminent.
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18. dekhn+ed[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 04:48:54
>>SkyPun+B3
This sort of property ("loosely tell it what it needs to do, step-by-step, and it does it.") is definitely very exciting and remarkable, but I don't think it necessarily constitutes AGI. I would say instead it's more an emergent property of language models trained on extremely large corpora that contain many examples that, in embedding space, aren't that far from what you're asking it to do.

I don't think LLMs have really demonstrated anything interesting around generalized intelligence, which although a fairly abstract concept, can be thought of as being able to solve truly novel problems outside their training corpora. I suspect there still needs to be a fair amount of work improving both the model design itself, the training data, and even the mental model of ML researchers, before we have systems that can truly reason in a way that demonstrates their generalized intelligence.

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19. morsec+Tf[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 05:07:30
>>MVisse+jb
Sure, people with aphasia lose the ability to form speech at all but if ChatGPT responded unintelligibly every time you wouldn't characterize it as intelligent.
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20. cscurm+in[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 06:02:40
>>Camper+79
This comparison again lol.

> As if most humans would do any better on those exercises.

Thats not the point. If you claim you have a machine that can fly, you can't get around a proof of that by saying "mOsT hUmAns cAnt fly" so therefore this machine not flying is irrelevant.

This thing either objectively reasons or not. It is irrelevant how well humans do on those tests.

> This thing is two years old. Be patient.

Nobody is cutting off the future. We are debating the current technology. AI has been around for 70 years. Just open any history book on AI.

At various points from 1950, the gullible mass claimed AGI.

replies(1): >>Camper+xB
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21. smolde+Xz[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 08:05:53
>>Camper+79
Transformer-based LLMs are almost a half-decade old at this point, and GPT-4 is the least-efficient model of it's kind ever produced (that I am aware of).

OpenAI's performance is not and has never been proportional to the size of their models. Their big advantage is scale, which lets them ship unrealistically large models by leveraging subsidized cloud costs. They win by playing a more destructive and wasteful game, and their competitors can beat them by shipping a cheaper competitive alternative.

What exactly are we holding out for, at this point? A miracle?

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22. Camper+xB[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 08:20:21
>>cscurm+in
At various points from 1950, the gullible mass claimed AGI.

Who's claiming it now? All I see is a paper slagging GPT4 for struggling in tests that no one ever claimed it could pass.

In any case, if it were possible to bet $1000 that 90%+ of those tests will be passed within 10 years, I'd be up for that.

(I guess I should read the paper more carefully first, though, to make sure he's not feeding it unsolved Hilbert problems or some other crap that smart humans wouldn't be able to deal with. My experience with these sweeping pronouncements is that they're all about moving the goalposts as far as necessary to prove that nothing interesting is happening.)

replies(1): >>cscurm+IY1
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23. cscurm+IY1[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 17:44:39
>>Camper+xB
The guy I replied to is claiming AGI:

>>38314733

"GPT 4 is clearly AGI. All of the GPTs have shown general intelligence, but GPT 4 is human-level intelligence. "

replies(1): >>Camper+352
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24. Camper+352[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-18 18:14:39
>>cscurm+IY1
Fair enough, that seems premature. Transformers are clearly already exceeding human intelligence in some specific ways, going back to AlphaGo. It's almost as clear that related techniques are capable of approaching AGI in the 'G' (general) sense. What's needed now is refinement rather than revolution.

Being able to emit code to solve problems it couldn't otherwise handle is a huge deal, maybe an adequate definition of intelligence in itself. Parrots don't write Python.

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25. spacem+Wi5[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-19 17:23:50
>>MVisse+Va
I’m pretty sure you have no data showing we’re heading to AGI because “compute and capabilities” is about as nebulous as it gets. You can’t just throw CPU cycles to strong arm your way to a solution to a problem you barely understand to begin with.
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