zlacker

Typically this is because programmers are treated as workers on assembly line instead of carpenters making beatiful chest of drawers.

>>yetihe+(OP)
One might also note, pound for pound, most chests of drawers are probably bought from Wal-Mart or Ikea.

>>Reacti+l
And unfortunately, since I enjoy woodworking, the Walmart chest of drawers is just as functional and often much better value than the finely crafted one. There’s virtue in building something accessible that improves things even if it doesn’t have “fine joinery” so to speak.

>>yetihe+(OP)
There is also a huge portion of programmers who want to be on an assembly line. They don't care about their profession, they don't strive to improve at their craft, they don't read stuff on HN. They're simply there for the money. Since quality requires active effort in software, I think this group has an oversized responsibility for tech debt.

Case in point: frontend and the shit show that's become.

>>c7DJTL+4c
The real part about front end being garbage that pissing me off is that people I have to speak on the phone with go on to patronize me about how “you know you can just use the online form, right?”

I COULD use the online form if the fucking thing ever worked!

Most recently was unable to book service for my vehicle online cause the selection lists always cleared themselves the moment I selected something. I click the year of my vehicle. It populates for an instant. Then clears.

Then had a guy on the phone audibly upset at me for making him take the phone call to book service.

>>mikeyo+12
Much better value? I disagree. High quality products built by artisans mean you aren’t participating(as much) in globalist, race-to-the-bottom corporate behavior. You know where your dollars are going and mostly what was involved in making it. Not to mention, handcrafted, high quality furniture lasts so much longer too, like multiple lifetimes.

All it takes is placing ethics (physical resource use, living standards of those who make your stuff) higher in your value approximation. I hate spending money on disposable goods with a passion, as a result I value the walmart chest of drawers negatively because owning and using it will make me unhappy.

>>rivers+T71
That's all very well, but the average person does not have the money to spend on well-crafted furniture. At the end of the day, they need somewhere to store their stuff and a cheap chest of drawers does the job. Ethics about buying choices are for people with money and will make zero difference in the grand scheme of things. Maybe that chest of drawers falls apart after 5 years instead of 20, but that's not going to sway a person who just gets by financially.

If you hate globalisation, then maybe that can be tackled with better legislation, improvements in working conditions and standards of living, and other systematic changes. It's not going to be changed by lecturing poor people on the ethics of buying cheap stuff.

>>danjac+OW1
Exactly. A relative of mine works for a fine furniture company in the Midwest, they have a production line making high-quality items with traditional joinery and actual hardwood and hardwood veneers. We were shopping for furniture for our house and needed a big dresser, I reached out and their version cost $8,000. That would support American jobs and my relative directly, but $8,000! We ended up with a West Elm one in a similar style for $1,800. A Walmart one with cheap particle board could be had for $800. Even if the Walmart one only lasted 5-years, you could buy 50-years worth for the same price as the US-made one.

Weighing "Value" means you need to consider many dimensions and people have different weights, priorities and abilities to service those dimensions.

At some level, a dresser is just a box for my t-shirts and socks. Similarly a link-shortening website probably doesn't need a typesafe, fully commented code base.