NOW would be different because, again, this system is worse than Apple's, and because Chrome has a larger influence on the web than Safari (on Desktop, on mobile its a foregone conclusion since you're not allowed a different engine other than Safari anyways, so the real fight there is allowing third party engines).
Does this answer your concerns? I can't tell if you are defending Apple and Google, or are against both but are using this what-about-ist accusation as a way to vent general frustration.
Google can turn around tomorrow and say that no browser without WEI can access GMail, GMaps, GSheets, Photos etc; people will have to comply, effectively killing any browser that does not support the feature.
This is the problem with the Chromium monoculture. "We", as generic IT people and developers on HN, definitely have a responsibility for not deprecating this monoculture earlier. If you use Brave, you're guilty; if you use Ungoogled Chromium, you're guilty; if you use Safari, you're guilty. It's high time people start taking responsibility.
Apple's just more subtle than Google.
... oh wait, they already did. They force a monoculture on all the platforms they can get away with, and even shipped this WEI crap already.
That even Microsoft couldn't manage to keep up with progress only shows how utterly impossible it would be to kickstart a browser engine.
(The fact that Mozilla as an organization is embedded in constant infighting and utter incompetence doesn't help either)
Citation? To be sure, there was not universal outrage over Safari's attestation implementation, but out of curiosity I looked up the only thread I was aware of, in part because I couldn't remember what my reaction was at the time. That thread was a year ago and the overwhelming sentiment of the comments section is critical: >>31751203
Here were my comments at the time:
They're less forceful than they are now with Google, partially because I know more now about how attestation works than I did over a year ago, and partially because (as some people have also pointed out) Chrome's implementation is straightforwardly more dangerous than Apple's is.
But HN "actively defending" Safari? That's not the impression I get from the overall comment section and it's definitely not what I personally was doing. There are a lot of people in these comments calling Apple's implementation DRM. So I'm a little skeptical of the "nobody on HN cared about this with Safari" narrative that has sprung up; from what I can see media coverage was fairly positive, but people on HN were rightly critical. I'm not sure the facts match the narrative: Safari was criticized for this.
It's a fair critique that there wasn't a coordinated attempt to outright stop Apple, but I would once again remind everyone that attestation in Chrome is way more dangerous than attestation in iOS. The market matters, that's not context that can be ignored. So it's not really all that weird to me that people are more willing to react more strongly to abusive behavior in Chrome.
The point is not that Google cares about those sites - they don't. Those services are leverage that they use to control web standards, in order to enable their real cash-cow: AdSense. They will use their web properties to shove down our throats anything that makes AdSense more profitable, from the anti-adblock measures in Chrome to this one.
> If we're all dependent on them enough that that's a problem for us, then that dependency is the problem
I don't disagree - and I use Firefox, keep my important mail outside of Gmail, etc etc. But I recognize that many, many people don't, so the technologically literal out there have an ethical responsibility to push back against corruption of the open web.
We had a shot at open browser engine development with limited scope. Everyone said no, not just Chrome. Mozilla and Apple both have blood on their hands too, if we want to be reductive.
We would’ve gotten Electron any other way if it wasn’t Chromium, it’s the only endgame for UI given how native layers shat the bed.
Mozilla also no longer even supports embedding. ;P
> it is the only game for developers that couldn't care
Yeah, dude. Most devs literally do not care, they just want to write and ship stuff. The native stack(s) are not cohesive enough and the numbers do not lie; devs do not want to rewrite the UI n times.
Signed, someone who also does native and web UI dev. ;P