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1. willia+(OP)[view] [source] 2022-10-16 21:29:14
I'm not sure sure that originality is that different between a human and a neural network. That is to say that what a human artist is doing has always involved a lot of mixing of existing creations. Art needs to have a certain level of familiarity in order to be understood by an audience. I didn't invent 4/4 time or a I-IV-V progression and I certainly wasn't the first person to tackle the rhyme schemes or subject matter of my songs. I wouldn't be surprised if there were fragments from other songs in my lyrics or melodies, either from something I heard a long time ago or perhaps just out of coincidence. There's only so much you can do with a folk song to begin with!

BTW, what happened after the photograph is that there were less portrait artists. And after the recording there were less live musicians. There are certainly no less artists nor musicians, though!

replies(2): >>ghowar+P1 >>amanuo+sM
2. ghowar+P1[view] [source] 2022-10-16 21:49:33
>>willia+(OP)
> I'm not sure sure that originality is that different between a human and a neural network. That is to say that what a human artist is doing has always involved a lot of mixing of existing creations.

I disagree, but this is a debate worth having.

This is why I disagree: humans don't copy just copyrighted material.

I am in the middle of developing and writing a romance short story. Why? Because my writing has a glaring weakness: characters, and romance stands or falls on characters. It's a good exercise to strengthen that weakness.

Anyway, both of the two people in the (eventual) couple developed from my real life, and not from any copyrighted material. For instance, the man will basically be a less autistic and less selfish version of myself. The woman will basically be the kind of person that annoys me the most in real life: bright, bubbly, always touching people, etc.

There is no copyrighted material I am getting these characters from.

In addition, their situation is not typical of such stories, but it does have connections to my life. They will (eventually) end up in a ballroom dance competition. Why that? So the male character hates it. I hate ballroom dance during a three-week ballroom dancing course in 6th grade, the girls made me hate ballroom dancing. I won't say how, but they did.

That's the difference between humans and machines: machines can only copyright and mix other copyrightable material; humans can copy real life. In other words, machines can only copy a representation; humans can copy the real thing.

Oh, and the other difference is emotion. I've heard that people without the emotional center of their brains can take six hours to choose between blue and black pens. There is something about emotions that drives decision-making, and it's decision-making that drives art.

When you consider that brain chemistry, which is a function of genetics and previous choices, is a big part of emotions, then it's obvious that those two things, genetics and previous choices, are also inputs to the creative process. Machines don't have those inputs.

Those are the non-religious reasons why I think humans have more originality than machines, including neural networks.

replies(1): >>willia+Pl
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3. willia+Pl[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-10-17 00:53:46
>>ghowar+P1
Asked to give practical advice to starting writers, he said, “Read.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/30/books/early-cormac-mccart...

replies(2): >>ghowar+3q >>roboca+6u
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4. ghowar+3q[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-10-17 01:38:31
>>willia+Pl
And my advice is to read and live!

One of the reasons Roald Dahl was such a great writer is his life experiences. Read his books Boy and Solo.

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5. roboca+6u[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-10-17 02:15:11
>>willia+Pl
Imagine telling someone who wanted to learn a sport to watch it. I define someone that writes as a writer. It is the act of writing that enables you to then read and learn from others.

An example: a dyslexic friend and a dyslexic family member: their writing communication skills of both is now fine in part because their jobs required it from them (and in part because technology helps). I also had one illiterate friend, who has taught himself to read and write as an adult (basic written communication), due to the needs of his job. Learn by doing, and add observation of others as an adjunct to help you. Even better if you can get good coaching (which requires effort at your craft or sport).

Disclaimer: never a writer. Projecting from my other crafts/sports. Terribly written comment!

replies(1): >>ghowar+lx
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6. ghowar+lx[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-10-17 02:53:01
>>roboca+6u
Coming from an actual, though unpublished, writer: you are right.
7. amanuo+sM[view] [source] 2022-10-17 06:26:15
>>willia+(OP)
> I'm not sure sure that originality is that different between a human and a neural network.

It is, yes. For example, a neural network can't invent a new art style on its own, or at least existing models can't, they can only copy existing art styles, invented by humans.

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