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[parent] [thread] 16 comments
1. stef25+(OP)[view] [source] 2021-06-04 09:15:38
100K from a 5B budget is peanuts and you couldn't reasonably expect the person at the top to know the details of what each recipient of 100K is doing exactly.

If all of the 5B is spent on coronavirus research then it's a different story. Most likely it's spent on an incredibly wide array of topics.

replies(3): >>Closi+o3 >>andi99+u5 >>weaksa+uZ
2. Closi+o3[view] [source] 2021-06-04 10:03:27
>>stef25+(OP)
This is the difference between responsibility and accountability.

The person at the top might not know what each recipient is doing, but is still accountable for the funding decisions that were made (and oversaw the people and process that made those decisions on the organisations behalf).

replies(2): >>roryko+J5 >>rjzzle+sx
3. andi99+u5[view] [source] 2021-06-04 10:31:31
>>stef25+(OP)
Just take your excel sheet of funded project, filter by country then filter by city....
replies(1): >>cptski+2q
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4. roryko+J5[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 10:36:40
>>Closi+o3
Absolutely spot on. Who on Earth would downvote this?
replies(2): >>atatat+9e >>myfavo+qf
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5. atatat+9e[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 12:14:09
>>roryko+J5
Those who think it's acceptable to fund government very well, and then not hold them responsible for their choices.
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6. myfavo+qf[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 12:24:07
>>roryko+J5
Those who look at politics as sport and are mostly concerned that their team has lost this round.
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7. cptski+2q[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 13:46:59
>>andi99+u5
This amuses me because some people are going to incredulously think "you would never keep such important information in excel" and others are going to skeptically say "there's no way they've managed to consolidate that down to just one excel file".
replies(2): >>marcos+3u >>andi99+UL
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8. marcos+3u[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 14:12:49
>>cptski+2q
I'm on the team thinking that there is no chance they got the city name correct and searchable on those Excel files.
replies(3): >>splith+NF >>cptski+kV >>cecilp+RW
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9. rjzzle+sx[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 14:33:19
>>Closi+o3
Is this a different grant than what I'm thinking of? The institution that got the grant is a global non-profit(I think, and run by americans afair). They actually appealed this and said how damaging this is because they've had a long term working relationship with various labs across the globe relating to virus research. They've been on This Week on Virology many times on a variety of different subjects. Is the funding in question here different from that? Rand Paul makes it sound like the money went directly to China, which isn't the case.
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10. splith+NF[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 15:24:32
>>marcos+3u
Or the person searching it ctrl+f’d a typo. Or a Chinese intern who helped compile the spreadsheet deleted that row on “accident”.

People are too quick to notice conflicts of interest. Everyone of us lives a life filled with such conflicts, yet we manage somehow to rise above, for the most part. Fauci seems like a nice guy to me.

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11. andi99+UL[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 15:55:41
>>cptski+2q
I am in the camp believing that there are actually at least 2 full time positions just for compiling/maintaining these excel files.
replies(1): >>cptski+WV
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12. cptski+kV[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 16:41:10
>>marcos+3u
I inherited a application for grants tracking database last year and the grants themselves do not have a location. There are persons and institutions associated with each Application/Grant, and each of those has a location.

Interestingly, the application is designed for a very specific workflow, audit and review as part of the intake, but has no facilities for auditing after the fact. The data and relationships exist and there is a wealth of information in the database including known conflicts of interest but there's no easy way to query or browse this data from the application unless you're reviewing a specific grant or application.

For example:

The application doesn't allow you to search for persons by location and doesn't show you grants associated with persons. Rather you can only see persons associated with grants.

You can search for institution by address but again, it doesn't show you grants associated with an institution.

These interfaces were designed to just update Persons or Institutions when changes occur. They weren't intended as a way to back into a Grant or Application.

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13. cptski+WV[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 16:44:28
>>andi99+UL
In our org there's an entire team in the Research department dedicated to maintaining grants/applications and they rely on staff in IT and Finance for continuous support. If I had to hazard a guess, I would say it's at least 15 people.
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14. cecilp+RW[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-04 16:47:42
>>marcos+3u
They did filter, but the details for that lab showed the country as "Wuhan" and the city as "Chona".
15. weaksa+uZ[view] [source] 2021-06-04 16:58:38
>>stef25+(OP)
to expand on just how small comparatively that number is... 100,000 seconds is a little over 1 day worth of seconds... 5 billion seconds is a little bit over 158 years of seconds.
replies(1): >>Closi+MT2
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16. Closi+MT2[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-05 07:41:57
>>weaksa+uZ
This isnt a good political argument for Fauci though, because the next question from a reporter would be something like:

> “So you are saying that the organisation you lead helped fund a lab that caused a pandemic, but that funding was without your oversight because you thought it wasn’t important/big enough for you to look at? Are you going to resign?”

Note, I don’t believe the above is a fair question, but Fauci has to be careful to not set himself up for a gotcha.

replies(1): >>Throwa+gX2
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17. Throwa+gX2[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-06-05 08:32:13
>>Closi+MT2
Given the extreme danger of gain of function experiments, whatever their claimed benefits, while Fauci per his early February FIOA found email(s) wasn't aware his NIH institute was funding at the Wuhan Institute of Virology, it could be argued he should have arranged to be in the loop for all of such grants and was doing his best to make sure they were done as safely as possible.

That's not to say it would have made any difference, unless per the article per the Bat Woman "The coronavirus research in our laboratory is conducted in BSL-2 or BSL-3 laboratories," "our" includes all the WIV's coronavirus research—it's a fair size outfit with a number of labs and there's no reason to assume she was the Principle Investigator for all of its coronavirus research—and he or a direct report could have insisted the funded research would be done at the BSL-4 lab or maybe one of the BSL-3 labs. This assume the gain of function research was being done at a lower level, which starting with the 2011 bird flu work in the West has been too often true, one or both of those labs were BSL-2, one of the reasons it was controversial and so alarming to a lot of people watching this including myself.

But it turned out without his knowledge gain of function research there was being funded by his institute through the EcoHealth Alliance, and in another email he's thanked by it's leader Peter Daszak for helping to push the zoonotic transfer explanation, which the latter was or had arranged through a group letter to The Lancet to be the only acceptable narrative until around now.

It would also have been good if someone had done a gut check on the EcoHealth Alliance's MO, which as described by a Rutgers' biological chemistry professor was "looking for a gas leak with a lighted match" by as the author of the Vanity Fair article as "bringing samples from a remote area to an urban one, then sequencing and growing viruses and attempting to genetically modify them to make them more virulent."

Again, nothing unique to the Alliance or China, the US is in the process of moving the research on animal pathogens done at Plumb Island, New York to college town Manhattan, Kansas. Which I'm sure is a much more pleasant place to work at, but just happened to be in the heartland of American animal agriculture. Someday one or more Congressmen who fought to bring home the bacon may be called to account for this, to the extent that ever happens.

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