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[return to "How to quit cars"]
1. acabal+Zc[view] [source] 2023-05-18 15:44:13
>>amathe+(OP)
I've been railing against cars in the US for years and years. The thing is that today most people in the US under the age of 60 grew up in cars, usually in a suburban environment, and it's actually impossible for them to imagine what life without a car might even look like. It's like trying to describe a color. If we can't even visualize an alternative, how are we supposed to achieve the alternative?

Only by traveling to places that were developed before cars took a chokehold on the world can people realize how nice it is to live without them absolutely everywhere.

Many Americans get a taste of that when they vacation to Europe. They often choose to leave their suburb and spend their 2 weeks in urban environments like Barcelona, London, Munich, Paris, Rome, etc., that where built for people and not cars, because it's so pleasant to live like that, and because letting cities develop for people first leads to cities that people actually want to be in, with car-free streets, plazas, promenades, etc. (Yes, today those places are also full of cars. But, unlike American cities, their skeletons are people-first and cars are the invasive element.)

It could be argued that so many problems of American life - weight gain, loneliness, fracturing of the social fabric - stem from how we've isolated ourselves in unwalkable suburbs, where there's no spontaneous social interaction because everyone's always in a car, and where our only exercise is the walk from the parking lot to our desk.

What's depressing is visiting developing countries and seeing them start to ape the worst of American car life. Places like Colombia, which I visit often, are building shopping malls, big-box stores, parking lots, suburbs, and freeways, while after almost 100 years of that type of car-first development in America we're only just starting to realize that actually it might not be that great.

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2. cal5k+aH1[view] [source] 2023-05-18 22:50:00
>>acabal+Zc
> What's depressing is visiting developing countries and seeing them start to ape the worst of American car life.

What a patronizing take. Cars are freedom - you can go where you like, when you like, with whom you like, and you can do it without dealing with crowded, noisy, sometimes dangerous buses/trams/subways. It's as true in the developing world as it is here.

As for such things happening in Colombia, it turns out that Colombians like the same things as Americans - they just previously didn't have the money to afford them.

Like, what's the alternative? Developing economies go from grinding poverty to bicycle-centric urban planning utopia by... top-down fiat? How do you propose to stop Colombians from voting with their wallets when they choose to eat at chain restaurants, shop at big box stores and then take the freeway back to their air-conditioned 2000 sq ft houses in the suburbs? "Sorry Mr. Middle Class Colombian, I know you really like McDonalds... but trust us, we're saving you from your own bad choices."

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3. zip123+SR1[view] [source] 2023-05-18 23:54:48
>>cal5k+aH1
Freedom? Cars as freedom is such a misconception. They are highly regulated. They take up so much space that they are difficult to store and require subsidized storage everywhere one goes. They create massive amounts of pollution both in particulates and noise, causing health problems to those that have to live near them. Cities are not noisy--cars are noisy. They certainly have their use but the negative externalities are exceptional and are not paid for by the users of the cars.
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4. bluGil+Qa2[view] [source] 2023-05-19 02:52:13
>>zip123+SR1
They are still freedom. Nothing else gives the overall ability to get where you want to go when you want to.
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5. throwu+0d2[view] [source] 2023-05-19 03:16:36
>>bluGil+Qa2
I don’t own a car, and looking around at all of the people who do, I can’t imagine making all of their sacrifices.

The total cost of owning a car sets you back enough to impact all other aspects of your life. Cars are inconvenient to store, maintain, and keep from getting damaged or stolen, which seems to be a constant source of anxiety. Keep driving for long enough and they’re likely to maim or kill you eventually. And in the end, they’re not even that convenient - people behind wheel seem to always be pissed. No wonder, I’d be pissed too if I had to spend 20 minutes looking for a spot to park my stinky mobile death trap. You can keep your freedom.

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