zlacker

[parent] [thread] 91 comments
1. inetkn+(OP)[view] [source] 2025-07-24 22:26:12
> why do all these business leaders all do the same things at the same time? E.g. Layoffs + micromanagement + cost focus etc... Is this truly about macroeconomic forces that every business is responding to? Or is it just following the latest fad?

I thought about this a lot over the years.

I saw something that piqued my interest last year though, and kind've helped connect the dots. I was on a cruise, and most of the ship was available to guests. One day, one room was cordoned off to an invite-only meeting. The windows weren't blocked, but on the screen was a presentation about AI investments, number of jobs saved (reduced), and etc.

I found one of the attendants later during the voyage and chatted her up. She was head of HR in some big company, and the meeting was supposed to be private. But it contained a lot more than just spreadsheets about AI investments. There was homework and whatnot, but the attendees weren't all from a single company. It was "direction setting". I don't think it was Intel (topic under discussion) but certainly some loosely related tech industry.

I'm convinced that it was nothing less than business collusion.

So, back to your question:

> why do all these business leaders all do the same things at the same time?

Because they're told to.

replies(15): >>mathge+8 >>wahnfr+f >>Dragon+V >>saubei+N3 >>figass+hb >>michae+pb >>fzeror+bc >>mandee+fd >>aeon_a+Kg >>jdlsho+yh >>lumost+1q >>dstroo+ks >>fireca+nC >>pyuser+8I >>alecco+2X
2. mathge+8[view] [source] 2025-07-24 22:27:23
>>inetkn+(OP)
> I'm convinced that it was nothing less than business collusion.

Wonder if it’s “not illegal” if it’s done in international waters.

replies(3): >>inetkn+H >>Distri+yN >>action+Z5c
3. wahnfr+f[view] [source] 2025-07-24 22:28:23
>>inetkn+(OP)
Heaven forbid the workers within or across any of these companies also consider coordinating on anything
replies(3): >>markus+I >>lbrito+h1 >>devinp+Y7
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4. inetkn+H[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-24 22:31:49
>>mathge+8
> Wonder if it’s “not illegal” if it’s done in international waters.

I didn't ask. As I understand it, it's less about legality and more about plausible deniability; on a "party boat" with plenty of other public people to make it cheaper than renting a whole boat, plus the week for the cruise and time to relax -- seems plausible that these people "just happened" to book the same boat at the same time at peak tourist season and decide to throw a "private party". I should have asked more questions, but there were plenty of other people to chat up.

replies(1): >>ghaff+Ld
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5. markus+I[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-24 22:31:55
>>wahnfr+f
The elites definitely unite first.
6. Dragon+V[view] [source] 2025-07-24 22:33:22
>>inetkn+(OP)
The Capital Order lays out an argument that austerity measures are ultimately labor suppression, not necessary. Of course, that’s true of many pieces of policy wisdom: they start from an assumed good. In this case, the assumed good is the current winners should remain the winners despite, well, losing.

https://www.amazon.com/Capital-Order-Economists-Invented-Aus...

replies(1): >>cyanyd+4a
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7. lbrito+h1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-24 22:35:38
>>wahnfr+f
That would be (gasp) _communism_!
replies(1): >>cebert+04
8. saubei+N3[view] [source] 2025-07-24 22:52:37
>>inetkn+(OP)
The capitalist class has always conspired to keep labor down.

Meanwhile, a lot of laborers in our profession have fallen for their propaganda of markets and so-called meritocracy, not realizing they have more in common with the fruit picker than their common exploiter.

Class warfare is real. It's time tech workers wake up to that fact and start fighting back instead of letting oligarchs walk over them.

replies(3): >>suppor+m6 >>beezle+nf >>Mistle+wS
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9. cebert+04[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-24 22:54:09
>>lbrito+h1
Unionization isn’t necessarily communism.
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10. suppor+m6[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-24 23:11:47
>>saubei+N3
Don't they realize that if they raise the labor class up, they will correspondingly raise themselves up by a multiple?
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11. devinp+Y7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-24 23:22:39
>>wahnfr+f
That's basically what the founders of Intel did, when they left Shockley to start Fairchild: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traitorous_eight
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12. cyanyd+4a[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-24 23:38:51
>>Dragon+V
I agree that this definitely is labor suppression, but it has a real cause: the end of low interest rates and inflation. They can no longer "grow" their way into their 6 month bonuses, so they basically have to trim fat and if they all collude on doing it, it _can_ work. If they dont all collude, someone gets cheap engine for growth.
replies(4): >>astran+vf >>neverm+yf >>8note+Tf >>mempko+uD
13. figass+hb[view] [source] 2025-07-24 23:48:31
>>inetkn+(OP)
Probably by majority portfolio owners
14. michae+pb[view] [source] 2025-07-24 23:49:25
>>inetkn+(OP)
> I'm convinced that it was nothing less than business collusion.

Are you sure you didn't just see a sales meeting?

If you're a farmer in the market for a $200k combine harvester, sales guys will be happy to put you in a $200-a-night hotel so you can attend their invite-only presentation on how their latest models give you 10% more yield with 30% lower labour cost thanks to the new auto-steer mechanism and six-stage threshing mechanism. And they'll hand-hold you through all the calculations to write a business case.

replies(4): >>inetkn+Nf >>sampla+ao >>bushba+7J >>HelloN+oY
15. fzeror+bc[view] [source] 2025-07-24 23:56:41
>>inetkn+(OP)
Given the whole Realpage stuff for price fixing, it would not surprise me if there are similar things going on at the csuite layer with various business consultants and backroom discussions. They're all rich assholes, and naturally gravitate to the same venues.

It's all the more reason why labor needs to start being more aggressive and properly work together.

replies(2): >>astran+Df >>ralph8+el
16. mandee+fd[view] [source] 2025-07-25 00:07:42
>>inetkn+(OP)
> why do all these business leaders all do the same things at the same time? E.g. Layoffs + micromanagement + cost focus etc...

They all work with restructuring companies!! So, I hope that tells you how smart they are :-)

replies(1): >>nyarla+9s
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17. ghaff+Ld[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:12:28
>>inetkn+H
It's very common for "million dollar clubs" (or whatever) to have a cruise or some other perk for top-performing sales reps.
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18. beezle+nf[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:25:26
>>saubei+N3
How though? Unions or something else?
replies(1): >>baq+dU
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19. astran+vf[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:27:12
>>cyanyd+4a
Also the end of full R&D expensing, which made software engineers in particular much more expensive in the US.
replies(2): >>axus+Vk >>dv_dt+ZB
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20. neverm+yf[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:27:42
>>cyanyd+4a
I can’t imagine anyone colluding with LBT, unless they told him it was collusion to fool him, and he fell for it.

Doing more with less is warning sign like “curve ahead”.

And the agentic focus is not forward-thinking.

Our present is to a small degree agentic, and that will increase, but that won’t sustain because (1) latency and (2) technological evolution.

It’s more likely that everyone will have their own AI on-board which will have all of the data it needs in local storage that gets regular updates. Evolving to current agentic flows won’t help with that type of processing.

replies(1): >>HumanO+FL
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21. astran+Df[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:28:13
>>fzeror+bc
There is no "Realpage stuff for price fixing" that resulted in any price fixing.

That is, it's true that they tried to do it and the software exists. But it doesn't matter, because nobody is actually motivated to join the cartel (defecting is more profitable) and they have no enforcement for it.

replies(4): >>fzeror+dg >>8note+hg >>Dangit+rg >>inetkn+YG1
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22. inetkn+Nf[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:29:46
>>michae+pb
> Are you sure you didn't just see a sales meeting?

It's possible!

replies(1): >>dachri+NF
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23. 8note+Tf[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:30:25
>>cyanyd+4a
collusion to suppress wages predates tbe raising of interest rates or inflation increases.

all the big tech companies used to have no-poach agreements to not hire from each other, such that they didnt have to compete on price

replies(1): >>cyanyd+Eg1
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24. fzeror+dg[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:32:06
>>astran+Df
Did you spend any time looking at the RealPage lawsuits and the reason why it's a cartel, or the reason why people didn't defect?
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25. 8note+hg[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:32:29
>>astran+Df
im not sure what context youre replying in, but plenty of building managers joined the real page cartel, and successfully raise prices across the board.
replies(1): >>astran+hI2
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26. Dangit+rg[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:34:20
>>astran+Df
Big citation needed on "defecting is more profitable".
replies(1): >>astran+wh
27. aeon_a+Kg[view] [source] 2025-07-25 00:36:42
>>inetkn+(OP)
Business leaders operate in overlapping networks. Conferences, advisory boards, private equity connections, etc. When McKinsey or Bain gives similar advice to 50 companies, you get synchronized behavior that looks coordinated.

Labor categorization can be thought of in a more useful framework -- Category 1: Builders who don't know it yet. These people have the cognitive capability, work ethic, and problem-solving skills to create value independently, but they've been socialized to believe employment is the only viable path, or have yet to take the leap of starting "their own thing". They're retained and developed because they're essentially entrepreneurs who haven't discovered their own agency yet. Category 2: Consumers masquerading as producers. They extract more value than they create - through entitlement, minimal effort, or misaligned incentives. They're often the loudest about "worker rights" precisely because they have the most to lose from merit-based evaluation.

The pattern you're seeing (layoffs + micromanagement + cost focus) targets Category 2 while trying to retain Category 1. The economy can no longer subsidize low-value labor.

The interesting dynamic: Category 2 workers are often most vocal about collective action because individual performance evaluation threatens their position. Category 1 workers are more likely to focus on skill development and value creation, and frankly are the most to benefit from the evolution of AI tooling.

"Labor solidarity" messaging often fails to resonate with the most effective and productive workers.

replies(6): >>kevinv+qo >>lovich+Eq >>lmm+Iw >>csomar+8H >>wolves+RJ >>saagar+VQ
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28. astran+wh[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 00:42:36
>>Dangit+rg
The claim is that by not renting out some of your properties you can raise rent on the rest. But the way you make money from properties is by renting them, so if everyone else is refusing to do it then you get the rents from anyone who shows up.

That and if you don't rent out a property for long and leave it unused, it'll literally rot because nobody is there to notice squatters or water leaks or etc.

replies(1): >>Dangit+cv
29. jdlsho+yh[view] [source] 2025-07-25 00:42:57
>>inetkn+(OP)
As someone else said, it was probably a sales meeting or other corporate training. You’re off in conspiracy theory land.

No conspiracy theories are needed. Boards are incestious, most board members aren’t all that bright or forward looking, they have a lot of imposter syndrome about it, they worry about getting important trends wrong, and so they follow the herd. CEOs follow the board, companies follow the CEO, voila, everybody does the same thing at the same time.

And yes, I think there is an opportunity to zig while everyone else is zagging.

Also: major institutional investors (such as VCs) demand a seat on the board and then send their B team to actually sit through the board meetings of their less key investments. Those board members follow the investor company’s line, spreading it to lots of companies at once.

replies(1): >>7thacc+4A
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30. axus+Vk[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 01:11:26
>>astran+vf
Is the hypothesis that the next 24 months will be measurably better for software engineering jobs than the last 24 months?
replies(2): >>astran+FK >>chairm+JO
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31. ralph8+el[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 01:13:59
>>fzeror+bc
It’s called Mercer and Equifax. All large companies use them to collude on compensation.
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32. sampla+ao[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 01:46:27
>>michae+pb
>Are you sure you didn't just see a sales meeting?

Considering how much the sales division of many medium and large companies dictates the direction of the whole company, "sales meeting" and "business collusion" is often the same thing.

I've worked for FAR too many companies that have lost $60million in support and maintenance on a sub-par product that sales managed to sell for $30million gross... and then the sales division (and upper management) leave the company for something better. What a surprise.

replies(1): >>zavec+281
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33. kevinv+qo[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 01:49:07
>>aeon_a+Kg
So, say… airline pilots extract more value than they create?
34. lumost+1q[view] [source] 2025-07-25 02:03:31
>>inetkn+(OP)
There are a lot of venues through which collusion has become legal. Management consulting, private equity investments, conferences etc.

The incentives to collude are powerful.

replies(1): >>7thacc+wA
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35. lovich+Eq[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 02:08:24
>>aeon_a+Kg
> The economy can no longer subsidize low-value labor

Every year we get wealthier and wealthier as a society, so that means we are capable of less and labor has to take the haircut while capital keeps on as is.

We could subsidize 10s of thousands to hundreds of thousands of people to do literally nothing and not be any worse off than we were 15 years ago

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36. nyarla+9s[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 02:18:04
>>mandee+fd
> They all work with restructuring companies!! So, I hope that tells you how smart they are :-)

"When McKinsey Comes to Town" is an interesting read that covers a lot of this. It's worse than I thought.

37. dstroo+ks[view] [source] 2025-07-25 02:19:15
>>inetkn+(OP)
Here's an alternative take, but along similar lines. Many high level business leaders in large established companies loathe taking risks and sticking their necks out. Instead, they hire a management consulting company (think McKinsey) who do a study and make recommendations that said executive can take to the other execs, or to the board. If it works, executive takes credit. If not, it was those darn consultants. The thing is, the consultants are giving companies the same advice. In fact, it is even stronger when "competitor A and B" are already doing "strategy C" and they are ahead of you. I've seen this movie many times...
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38. Dangit+cv[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 02:42:15
>>astran+wh
You never have to let any properties rot, you intentionally delay filling them to achieve the desired number of vacancies at any given time. And yes in principle competition is king but in practice it's for suckers.
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39. lmm+Iw[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 02:54:50
>>aeon_a+Kg
> The interesting dynamic: Category 2 workers are often most vocal about collective action because individual performance evaluation threatens their position. Category 1 workers are more likely to focus on skill development and value creation, and frankly are the most to benefit from the evolution of AI tooling.

> "Labor solidarity" messaging often fails to resonate with the most effective and productive workers.

That's what the rentier class wants you to think. It's convenient if everyone is a temporarily embarrassed CEO, makes them much happier to act against their own class interests.

replies(1): >>aeon_a+c22
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40. 7thacc+4A[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 03:28:03
>>jdlsho+yh
Yes, it's most likely they saw some kind of sales meeting, but collusion also happens often. I watched a documentary not long ago about how smart they are about it now. For groceries the major chains just all report each product's price to the same company which then tells them how much they can mark up their products without being undercut. Is it illegal, almost assuredly yes. Is there anybody enforcing this anymore? No.
replies(1): >>pyuser+HI
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41. 7thacc+wA[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 03:31:36
>>lumost+1q
Management consulting is a big one. It's illegal for companies to all tell each other their prices and costs. What isn't illegal? Apparently each firm hiring McKinsey who will tell you what your competitors costs and prices are because they have "industry knowledge". They'll then share your information too and then everyone can largely figure out how they can set prices above their marginal costs with some nice padding. It's probably still illegal, but it's what these firms do.
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42. dv_dt+ZB[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 03:49:25
>>astran+vf
But that got rolled back in the last budget bill if i was following correctly
43. fireca+nC[view] [source] 2025-07-25 03:53:54
>>inetkn+(OP)
>> why do all these business leaders all do the same things at the same time?

> Because they're told to.

This is largely it.

Consultants rule the earth!

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44. mempko+uD[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 04:07:48
>>cyanyd+4a
High interest rates benefit creditors and hurt debtors. These companies hold a lot of cash equivalent assets (think bonds, etc). Their balance sheets only grew. High interest rates haven't hurt these companies, but instead fattened them up. They are hoarding cash! Imagine earning high interest on that cash.
replies(1): >>cyanyd+CH4
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45. dachri+NF[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 04:40:33
>>inetkn+Nf
It is, but cui bono. I know that local software companies in my city had meetings coordinating the local software dev wage level. There's no reason to assume something like this isn't going on at a larger scale too.
replies(1): >>bn-l+cJ
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46. csomar+8H[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 05:03:43
>>aeon_a+Kg
My guess is that these layoffs will end up firing cat 1 and keeping cat 2.
replies(1): >>aeon_a+x22
47. pyuser+8I[view] [source] 2025-07-25 05:17:31
>>inetkn+(OP)
Isn’t this straight up illegal? Anti-trust laws are no jokes. Many conventions have strict rules to prevent it.

I’ve been involved on layoff planning. It can be very cloak and dagger. But you never involve competitors. Ever.

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48. pyuser+HI[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 05:25:08
>>7thacc+4A
Lol. When I was a kid I worked at a gas station. My job was to arrive before the station opemed, drive around the neighborhood, and make a note of the gas price at our competitors.

We then informed corporate of the numbers, and someone would quickly is how to price the gas that day.

I thought it was about keeping the price competitive. No, I was told, it’s the exact opposite.

We would gladly sell the gas at cost, if not less, because the real money came from coffee and other merch.

But the state had a minimum mark up law. We had to charge the customers more.

The idea was to protect small gas stations from corporate chains, but gas is a commodity. Everyone pays about the same.

I later found out that the reason I was reason I was recording the competitors prices was to make sure they were following the minimum markup laws, so we could sue them if they werent.

replies(1): >>grutur+eX
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49. bushba+7J[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 05:27:58
>>michae+pb
You don’t have sales meetings from a vendor on a cruise ship in the west. Thats considered bribery
replies(6): >>bboygr+cN >>saagar+dQ >>theshr+KQ >>baq+tT >>HSO+LT >>hdgvhi+f01
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50. bn-l+cJ[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 05:29:09
>>dachri+NF
Is that strictly legal?
replies(1): >>consp+gU
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51. wolves+RJ[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 05:37:15
>>aeon_a+Kg
False consciousness at its finest
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52. astran+FK[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 05:47:11
>>axus+Vk
Hard to say. There's kind of a lot going on.
replies(1): >>jordan+ZF1
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53. HumanO+FL[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 05:58:35
>>neverm+yf
Erm, what?
replies(1): >>DJK-44+JW
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54. bboygr+cN[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 06:12:11
>>bushba+7J
Well this is an extremely naive take.

You can rest assured that bribery in that way is extremely common in the West.

replies(1): >>red-ir+Yo1
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55. Distri+yN[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 06:16:40
>>mathge+8
No, because jurisdiction of the competition authority will still be based on the market activity (or place of registration etc.) of the companies colluding, not on the physical location of the colluding/anti-competitive activity itself. While such conspirative theatre may decrease the risks of discovery, collusions usually come to light by one participant notifying the authority in exchange for immunity or decreased fines.
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56. chairm+JO[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 06:30:26
>>axus+Vk
Probably in China.
replies(1): >>red-ir+9p1
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57. saagar+dQ[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 06:44:01
>>bushba+7J
Where do you think the sales meetings happen lol
replies(1): >>KingMo+IZ
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58. theshr+KQ[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 06:49:14
>>bushba+7J
You call it "training" and it's all good.
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59. saagar+VQ[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 06:50:16
>>aeon_a+Kg
You’re a category 1 worker, I take it? Or maybe beyond categories because you’re an owner and not labor?
replies(1): >>aeon_a+M22
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60. Mistle+wS[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 07:06:08
>>saubei+N3
The problem is every tech worker sees themselves as a temporarily embarrassed oligarch in waiting.
replies(1): >>LakesA+lZ
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61. baq+tT[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 07:15:03
>>bushba+7J
Sir.
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62. HSO+LT[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 07:18:16
>>bushba+7J
LOL ok call it a "conference" then

Or better yet: a "summit"

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63. baq+dU[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 07:23:55
>>beezle+nf
Unions are counterweight for HR. You want coops to get at least some pooled capital. Otherwise you need investors or debt and end up in the same place you started.
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64. consp+gU[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 07:24:32
>>bn-l+cJ
Almost nowhere. But hard to prove in court. You should report it to the local authorities at least.
replies(3): >>toyg+Ri1 >>frankt+Km1 >>nradov+3J2
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65. DJK-44+JW[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 07:48:39
>>HumanO+FL
He’s from the future, dammit!
66. alecco+2X[view] [source] 2025-07-25 07:50:15
>>inetkn+(OP)
> Because they're told to.

Blackrock, Vanguard, State Street.

replies(1): >>DebtDe+Jj1
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67. grutur+eX[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 07:51:36
>>pyuser+HI
They were probably having you do this so that they could price the gas as high as possible while still in line with the neighborhood going price. Why sell at 200 while the best next price nearby is 260? Sell at 250.
replies(1): >>pyuser+Cx1
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68. HelloN+oY[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 08:01:35
>>michae+pb
A "sales meeting", intended in a loose sense, can cause involuntary and/or uncoordinated pseudo-collusion because it aligns various parties: a level playing field of information (e.g. convincing important managers of many companies that their strategy needs more AI and less actual experts) leads to similar forecasts and similar decisions.
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69. LakesA+lZ[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 08:11:40
>>Mistle+wS
I’d say this applies to a far broader group; I’ll never forget when a professor asked for a show of hands on the first day of class: “how many of you will have more than 10 million?”

More than half raised their hands immediately. It was a Philosophy 101 class.

replies(2): >>saubei+h41 >>rchaud+gl1
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70. KingMo+IZ[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 08:16:12
>>saagar+dQ
I conduct my sales meetings in open sewers. There may be whiffs of garbage, but not impropriety.
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71. hdgvhi+f01[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 08:21:55
>>bushba+7J
Yes it’s at vegas instead.
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72. saubei+h41[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 09:07:07
>>LakesA+lZ
This is exactly what I'm referring to when saying "they fell for the propaganda".
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73. zavec+281[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 09:49:14
>>sampla+ao
Now I'm trying to remember what that tech company (I think pretty small, startup-sized ish but large enough that they would normally have at least one person in sales) that just straight up decided not to have a sales department was
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74. cyanyd+Eg1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 11:21:24
>>8note+Tf
That real world activity is my underlying belief, but we shouldnt ignore that the free money era ended quickly and for these execs do continue to earn their ungainly bonuses, they have to cut costs. Modern texhnology/capitalism allows them to make the same choices without directing collusion.

Best example is the rental market and the landlords all using the same price setting "algorithm"

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75. toyg+Ri1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 11:44:48
>>consp+gU
Yeah, everyone knows Jobs' mistake was to use email. This kinda thing is done very unofficially.
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76. DebtDe+Jj1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 11:52:42
>>alecco+2X
Notice how they stopped talking about this after the election?

But yes, together, the Big 3 are the single largest shareholder in 88% of SP500 companies.

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/business-and-politic...

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77. rchaud+gl1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 12:06:41
>>LakesA+lZ
$10 million sounds like peanuts in an information environment where discussion is dominated by talk of billionnaires. When I was growing up, I remember Bill Gates and Warren Buffett's wealth being touted as a measly $40 billion or something. Today the numbers tossed around for Bezos, Musk etc are minds numbingly massive, 200 to 300 billion.

Meanwhile most people in "rich" countries will have to reach mid-career status to even reach $100k.

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78. frankt+Km1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 12:20:21
>>consp+gU
LOL. Or do the early 1900s thing and kick somebodies ass badly.
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79. red-ir+Yo1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 12:37:56
>>bboygr+cN
and balls out about it, too.

used to be a sales engineer at an ISP. one you've heard of. we had account execs straight up offer "referral agent fees" to the network managers we were selling to.

bandwith is mostly the same -- 10Gbps here is more or less 10Gbps elsewhere -- so you gotta set yourself apart. and it worked. constantly.

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80. red-ir+9p1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 12:39:12
>>chairm+JO
not if 996 is still a thing
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81. pyuser+Cx1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 13:36:30
>>grutur+eX
They were worried about suing and being sued. In the place and time, gas stations simply did not make money off gas.

They made money by selling coffee, which costs less than a cent, for five bucks.

replies(1): >>grutur+fzh
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82. jordan+ZF1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 14:26:09
>>astran+FK
Either the tax treatment has an effect or it doesn't. If the market doesn't get better we can at the very least say that the whole tax thing was overstated.
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83. inetkn+YG1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 14:31:03
>>astran+Df
> There is no "Realpage stuff for price fixing" that resulted in any price fixing.

You must not have been renting apartments in any significant market during the 2010's

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84. aeon_a+c22[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 16:15:48
>>lmm+Iw
The "rentier class" framing assumes all value extraction happens at the top, but /r/overemployed will demonstrate that is false.

Low-performers extract value from high-performers at every organizational level. A developer carrying three mediocre teammates isn't being manipulated by "the rentier class" when they prefer merit-based evaluation.

Your argument requires believing that productive workers can't accurately assess their own interests.

replies(1): >>lmm+yz7
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85. aeon_a+x22[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 16:16:54
>>csomar+8H
Can't argue with that. Peter principle.
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86. aeon_a+M22[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 16:18:52
>>saagar+VQ
All categories are false - The framework is just useful for pointing out the flaws in other frameworks (i.e., simplistic marxism).
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87. astran+hI2[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 19:42:47
>>8note+hg
That's demand going up with fixed supply because the US made it illegal to build anything. In a market where supply goes up instead (Austin or Minneapolis) their algorithm is going to tell them to lower prices instead.
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88. nradov+3J2[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-25 19:47:34
>>consp+gU
Nonsense. There's nothing generally illegal about vendor sponsored junkets for private industry attendees. Some companies have policies against their own employees attending such events but that's not a legal issue.
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89. cyanyd+CH4[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-26 16:12:03
>>mempko+uD
My thesis is most of these companies grow by VC funding and leveraged buyout of smaller firms. This requires cheap debt servicing.
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90. lmm+yz7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-28 01:00:50
>>aeon_a+c22
> A developer carrying three mediocre teammates isn't being manipulated by "the rentier class" when they prefer merit-based evaluation.

What happens when they get their wish? Do they start getting paid something close to the combined salary of the team they were carrying? Or do they get an attaboy and a pizza, and a precedent for "merit-based" layoffs that will be turned against them soon enough? I know which way I've seen it play out.

> Your argument requires believing that productive workers can't accurately assess their own interests.

Is it so implausible that people skilled in a specific field might be bad at cooperating (perhaps because they're bad at communicating with each other, at least relative to another class) and politically naive? If you think workers have a good understanding of their own interests then why has the labour share of income kept dropping?

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91. action+Z5c[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-29 14:05:57
>>mathge+8
That argument mostly only works if you are the government, it seems.
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92. grutur+fzh[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-07-31 11:38:38
>>pyuser+Cx1
> They were worried about suing and being sued. In the place and time, gas stations simply did not make money off gas. > They made money by selling coffee, which costs less than a cent, for five bucks.

True. That's no reason to "leave money on the table" as they may have seen it, and being substantially cheaper than the alternative, when they could have been barely cheaper and attracting the same amount of people.

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