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1. jjuliu+(OP)[view] [source] 2024-01-10 20:48:03
For what it's worth, The Intercept has not been able to verify what this group is claiming.

>A SMALL GROUP of volunteers from Israel’s tech sector is working tirelessly to remove content it says doesn’t belong on platforms like Facebook and TikTok, tapping personal connections at those and other Big Tech companies to have posts deleted outside official channels, the project’s founder told The Intercept.

>The Intercept was unable to independently confirm that sympathetic workers at Big Tech firms are responding to the group’s complaints or verify that the group was behind the removal of the content it has taken credit for having deleted.

replies(3): >>cqqxo4+Gt >>amiga1+8q1 >>DoItTo+8m2
2. cqqxo4+Gt[view] [source] 2024-01-10 22:58:14
>>jjuliu+(OP)
Although this is in the grand scheme of things hard to verify. Who is going to admit to that? To a news organisation?
replies(3): >>jjuliu+Dx >>Cheer2+UB >>bawolf+P91
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3. jjuliu+Dx[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-10 23:16:39
>>cqqxo4+Gt
>Who is going to admit to that? To a news organisation?

Stranger things have been admitted to news organizations.

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4. Cheer2+UB[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-10 23:39:43
>>cqqxo4+Gt
> Who is going to admit to that? To a news organisation?

People who don't agree with what their coworkers are doing and want to be whistleblowers.

Getting those people to reach out to you is a huge part of investigative journalism.

replies(2): >>DeathA+7C1 >>gettod+zl2
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5. bawolf+P91[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 03:48:40
>>cqqxo4+Gt
At the same time, people do make stuff up on the internet. I don't think its fair to treat unverified rumour as fact.
replies(1): >>JeffSn+Ii1
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6. JeffSn+Ii1[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 05:02:30
>>bawolf+P91
> I don't think its fair to treat unverified rumour as fact.

Virtually all information about the current conflict in the near east between Israel and Palestine might be considered "unverified rumor", whether the entity relaying the information is a state or a person with a camera. For better or worse, this is a standard of information we need to deal with.

Perhaps the idea of a "fact" is something that needs revisiting as a concept....

replies(2): >>nyokod+Gq1 >>crater+xy1
7. amiga1+8q1[view] [source] 2024-01-11 05:58:47
>>jjuliu+(OP)
Who is the judge of “inflammatory” content? It’s just censorship plain and simple. Why not let the truth be told?

Edit: judging by the way the votes keep going up and down there's a yin to the gatekeepers of inflammatory content's yang. These are actions of a rogue state y'all.

replies(1): >>DeathA+GB1
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8. nyokod+Gq1[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 06:02:47
>>JeffSn+Ii1
> Perhaps the idea of a "fact" is something that needs revisiting as a concept

The field of epistemology is ancient. The problem of what can be known and how we can know is even older. I don't think this conflict raises any fundamentally new questions on an epistemic level.

replies(3): >>guerri+ky1 >>mlyle+jC1 >>JeffSn+ba3
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9. guerri+ky1[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 07:14:06
>>nyokod+Gq1
This is a terrible point because what philosophers know have nothing to do with what the general public needs to learn right now. The idea of a "fact" absolutely needs revising for almost all people.
replies(1): >>grolim+nl5
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10. crater+xy1[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 07:15:43
>>JeffSn+Ii1
Oh, you really need to read "Is Justified True Belief Knowledge?" https://academic.oup.com/analysis/article-lookup/doi/10.1093...
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11. DeathA+GB1[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 07:46:22
>>amiga1+8q1
>Why not let the truth be told?

Telling the truth is going to always be against someone's interest. If that someone can control the medium, he will do it.

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12. DeathA+7C1[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 07:49:18
>>Cheer2+UB
>Getting those people to reach out to you is a huge part of investigative journalism.

Does that still exist? If you do investigative journalism maybe you win the admiration of the public. If you align with the powers that be, no nasty things happen to you and maybe you earn some money.

replies(2): >>DarkBy+074 >>Aerbil+Ww7
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13. mlyle+jC1[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 07:51:13
>>nyokod+Gq1
No, but decline of traditional journalism, social media, artificial intelligence, and post-truth society sure calls into question a lot of best practices to figure out probable facts.

Epistemology hasn't changed; but the engineering of how one ensures they are probably reliably informed sure has.

On the flipside, we have a lot more information about how brains tend to process and weigh information to form beliefs.

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14. gettod+zl2[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 13:25:18
>>Cheer2+UB
The people with power over the journalists' career and reputation are in this case the party they'd piss off by doing proper journalism. They're not gonna do it. It's indirectly the main reason why no one trusts journalists in general anymore. Nearly everything is consolidated under the same people and whatever isn't gets smeared and blacklisted.
15. DoItTo+8m2[view] [source] 2024-01-11 13:29:18
>>jjuliu+(OP)
There is a network of pro-Israel and even Israeli government affiliated corporations and NGOs that successfully lobby for extreme censorship and social restrictions, such as a ban on sharing and even viewing all Gaza war footage in Australia, and the numerous anti-boycott and anti-organization rules across government organizations in 30+ American states.

Even if it can't be confirmed as of yet, I have no doubt that they are working on or have actually achieved the connections to make this possible.

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16. JeffSn+ba3[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 17:03:53
>>nyokod+Gq1
> I don't think this conflict raises any fundamentally new questions on an epistemic level.

There are plenty of philosophers that rejected the idea that objective consensus is possible, even more so when faced with assigning a truth value to arbitrary phrases. Off the top of my head, both Hume and Kant noted the impossibility of true posteriori certainty. You're quite correct that this is well-tread territory, but you're wrong to think that there's some widely agreed-upon, well-defined theory of truth or knowledge.

Pragmatically, we're completely immersed in floating signifiers and appear to rely on them for fundamental communication, so I'm more arguing for a move to discussion of degrees of certainty & consensus rather than a binary understanding of knowledge.

(...and this is even before diving into gettier problems!)

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17. DarkBy+074[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-11 20:38:45
>>DeathA+7C1
The world has already learned from doing this mistake. Despotism is bad and listening to the above is how you get there.
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18. grolim+nl5[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-12 03:44:05
>>guerri+ky1
I don't think that fact is an 'idea'; if something can't be proven to be true, it isn't a fact. We should consider calling it something else.

The concept that needs revising is our understanding of social media posts as being automatically considered 'facts'.

If it can't be proven, if we can't trust any vehicle to independently verify its veracity, then we simply have to check as many sources as we can and consider it as a possibility, not a fact.

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19. Aerbil+Ww7[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-01-12 18:21:46
>>DeathA+7C1
Yes, people with a strong sense of morality, interestingly (to the HN crowd), still do exist.
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