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1. reisse+(OP)[view] [source] 2023-11-20 11:00:01
> - Hire an independent investigator to dig into the entire process leading up to this point and generate a full report.

This is very interesting. You wouldn't normally hire an investigator to dig into a corporate shitshow. Firing of Sam Altman was a huge mess, but if there was a serious reason to do that (like, frauding the board), and that reason would be backed by investigation report, it'll suddenly make board actions much more justifiable. And it'll put Microsoft into a tough spot, because they hired Altman back without any considerations whatsoever...

replies(8): >>ahmedh+61 >>Joeri+i1 >>sillys+g2 >>dkjaud+ka >>bambax+ld >>qwerto+ke >>_the_i+oe >>mrandi+eH1
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2. ahmedh+61[view] [source] 2023-11-20 11:07:58
>>reisse+(OP)
That was a very good decision because I think the majority don't understand well what has happened, even inside OpenAI itself, and that's very weird.
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3. Joeri+i1[view] [source] 2023-11-20 11:09:06
>>reisse+(OP)
It could also just be that there are different stories of the situation that led up to this thing blowing up, and nobody inside OpenAI could be trusted to impartially do fact finding in matching up those narratives.

People confabulate just like AI does. Just because the stories don’t add up doesn’t mean somebody deliberately lied.

replies(1): >>pas+l8
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4. sillys+g2[view] [source] 2023-11-20 11:15:36
>>reisse+(OP)
I’ll eat my hat if Sam did something to justify the board’s response. Satya certainly knew the reason, as he was at the center of the negotiations to get Sam and Greg back to OpenAI.

Emmet is just doing the smartest thing to salvage the situation.

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5. pas+l8[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-20 11:54:18
>>Joeri+i1
it's probably even more prosaic than that. new CEO should not spend his attention on going through days or weeks worth of he-said-she-said. (he will find out who he can work with, who is hostile to him, soon enough - if not he's useless as CEO.)

but of course the question captivates the peanut gallery so there's a certain importance to it. so making this empty promise costs nothing, hence it's there.

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6. dkjaud+ka[view] [source] 2023-11-20 12:09:07
>>reisse+(OP)
It actually does happen reasonably often, typically they hire a lawyer to do a review. It represents a careful approach to governance -- remember OpenAI is a charity, so they're ultimately answerable to the relevant law than shareholders.
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7. bambax+ld[view] [source] 2023-11-20 12:30:44
>>reisse+(OP)
Yeah, I find this extremely weird. Doesn't sound like a super idea.

If the investigator finds the board was wrong, it makes the new CEO an enemy of the board. If the investigator finds Sam Altman did bad things, it makes Microsoft look bad and incompetent for hiring him; MS is OpenAI biggest client.

And if, as is likely, the investigator finds some blame here and there, and nothing conclusive, nobody's better off and a lot of time and energy was spent learning nothing.

What good can possibly come from this?

replies(1): >>iepath+Id
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8. iepath+Id[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-20 12:33:50
>>bambax+ld
If the board was in the wrong then they are already an enemy of the new CEO and he just doesn't know it yet. Investigation finds out if that's the case for the new CEO.
replies(2): >>bambax+Eg >>seanhu+NO3
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9. qwerto+ke[view] [source] 2023-11-20 12:38:00
>>reisse+(OP)
> it'll suddenly make board actions much more justifiable

The investigation would also include checking if the board had some odd intentions by ousting Sam; so, no, not necessarily.

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10. _the_i+oe[view] [source] 2023-11-20 12:38:06
>>reisse+(OP)
MS has the upper hand here. Don't underestimate a company that survived that much (anti-trust etc.)

If there is misconduct from Sam - he will get fired. If he succeeds - MS will benefit from whatever success means.

On the other hand, other competitors won't be able to porch Sam at this point. This is something many do not get. Whatever happens in the next few weeks to month, it won't hurt MS and won't benefit others, while on the outside we play the corporate compliance game.

OpenAI definitely needs professional structures. And MS will help them achieve that.

replies(1): >>pas+Rj
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11. bambax+Eg[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-20 12:51:47
>>iepath+Id
But they just hired him, and he accepted. It's a little late to dig into the past now.
replies(1): >>leoedi+ql
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12. pas+Rj[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-20 13:11:14
>>_the_i+oe
> to porch Sam

is this meant to be poach or my non-native-speakerness is showing? :)

replies(2): >>wholin+9s >>hugs+Ws
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13. leoedi+ql[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-20 13:19:42
>>bambax+Eg
The board aren't going to be able to hire someone who is both an effective and experienced CEO and willing to completely ignore their misconduct. If it turns out the actions of the board weren't reasonable, it's hard to see how it can survive in it's current form.

Emmet Shear presumably had very little to do with the prior events, but if he's going to salvage the company, he needs to control the narrative around the governance. That means either publicly justifying the boards actions or changing the board.

replies(1): >>theyin+Pq
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14. theyin+Pq[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-20 13:42:10
>>leoedi+ql
He is interim, most likely there to pick up the pieces with at least some kind of a carte blanche.
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15. wholin+9s[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-20 13:47:55
>>pas+Rj
Definitely poach
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16. hugs+Ws[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-20 13:50:20
>>pas+Rj
It probably was supposed to be "poach" and got autocorrected to "porch"...

but... it's a happy accident of new imagery. I imagine "porching" someone could mean to poach them... and then sit them on a nice rocking chair on the front porch, give them some lemonade, and make sure they do absolutely nothing.

(Kind of like how big companies acquire small, yet competitive, companies for no other reason than to put them out of business.)

I don't think Microsoft wants to "porch" Sam in this case, but they are happy to poach him and put him to work.

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17. mrandi+eH1[view] [source] 2023-11-20 19:02:20
>>reisse+(OP)
The primary motivation behind promising such an "investigation" is an attempt at employee retention by addressing one of OpenAI employee's key concerns, the abrupt, opaque and, frankly bizarre, behavior of the outside board members. We know it's a key employee concern because OpenAI's COO said so in his all-hands email to employees on Friday. This was confirmed in spades by the subsequent open letter to the board signed by over 600 (out of ~770) employees.

At this point we still have no idea what the outside board director's issue might have been but the fact that even their initial internal allies, co-founder/board member Ilya, CTO/interim CEO Mira and the COO, all stopped supporting the three outside directors after engaging directly with them over the weekend is pretty damning. Unfortunately, the scope, conduct and results of any such investigation are all entirely under the control of the three outside board members. The same outside directors that abruptly fired the last interim CEO and the CEO before her in a period of 48 hours. Unlike most boards, they aren't accountable to shareholders, investors, employees or anyone else.

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18. seanhu+NO3[view] [source] [discussion] 2023-11-21 08:23:01
>>iepath+Id
The investigation isn't going to find anything. The investigation is going to find that everyone acted properly, this was just one of those things and there's nothing anyone could have done. Here's a video. On the telephone call he's telling DeNiro the results of the investigation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBzfY8ABR9E
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