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1. javajo+(OP)[view] [source] 2022-12-16 02:51:06
>Then came the pedo guy comments. I cut him slack, he must be tired/strung out, he'll apologise. He never did.

Same. It's one thing to use a slur like that in some personal dispute; but this was against a hero who had saved children, and on a public forum. I've lied to myself that this was a minor dispute. And it would be that if he'd apologized. But the lack of apology is a very serious red flag of character. Impulsive unkind and unfair behavior is something we all are guilty of some time. But to not acknowledge it and make amends? That's wrong. Because the easy thing was the apology, sincere or not. Musk must have pushed back against his people to not apologize. Musk wanted to hurt that man, and he still wants to hurt him, would hurt him again if given the chance, worse if it was legal. And for what? Publicly criticizing Musk's (frankly hair-brained) idea to save those kids. (Honestly, I don't remember the details.) He reacted very badly to a fair criticism, with personal malice and rage, and he believes these reactions to be appropriate and, if anything, displaying admirable restraint.

I can't help but see echos of that lack of empathy, that meanness, as he takes his various actions now with Twitter - firing large swaths of staff, sending demanding emails to the remaining staff on very short term. We are all capitalists and so give a proven leader like Musk enormous leeway in this position. But his behavior has been absolutely rotten. Even layoffs can be delivered with more grace! His words and actions, apart from layoffs, feel like angry, vengeful behavior rather than "effective leader" behavior - all echoes of the "pedo guy" incident.

replies(2): >>hndami+85 >>exodus+8c
2. hndami+85[view] [source] 2022-12-16 03:16:46
>>javajo+(OP)
To give this more context, Vern Unsworth was mocking Elon Musks attempts to help on request of the lead diver, after providing many batteries and engineers time to work on a solution. Vern himself was not an actual diver in the rescue.
replies(1): >>dekhn+U6
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3. dekhn+U6[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-16 03:25:40
>>hndami+85
He wasn't a rescue diver, he was the local expert, having mapped the cave and knowing more about its structure than anybody else in the world. he was truly qualified to say that Elon's attempt wasn't going to work and was hogging to much attention.
replies(2): >>hndami+G9 >>postin+3B
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4. hndami+G9[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-16 03:40:51
>>dekhn+U6
But he initiated being derisive and mocking of another person whom was personally invited to help by the dive team. Contributed time and resources to the effort as per the instruction of the lead diver. Doesn't sound particularly heroic. People love to leave this out of the story that Vern Unsworth brought it on himself by initiating the negativity, wasn't a diver, and ultimately lost his case.
replies(3): >>dekhn+Jb >>jacque+Pb >>Raving+9c
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5. dekhn+Jb[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-16 03:53:08
>>hndami+G9
Yes, I agree he (vern) did "initiate it being derisive". It was a poor choice made by a person who was currently working in an active emergency that was being seen by the whole world. And I do know that he lost his case- a real shame in my mind.

He was a diver- just not a rescue diver in this case.

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6. jacque+Pb[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-16 03:53:36
>>hndami+G9
Unsworth had a bunch of lives to save and his response to Musk was - given the circumstances - a lot more courteous than I would have been in the same situation.
replies(1): >>hndami+6F
7. exodus+8c[view] [source] 2022-12-16 03:54:53
>>javajo+(OP)
> "the lack of apology is a very serious red flag"

Sounds like something a bot would write.

Musk's Twitter apology to the 'pedo guy' at the time made headlines. A simple google will sort out your confusion. He also apologized in court, and repeatedly stated how it was the stupidest thing he's done.

> "We are all capitalists..."

Again, sounds like something a chat bot would write.

replies(1): >>javajo+542
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8. Raving+9c[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-16 03:55:05
>>hndami+G9
That still doesn't excuse Elon though. If you respond to this comment by mocking me for being clueless does that give me the right to call you a pedo? It shouldn't.
replies(1): >>hndami+Kf4
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9. postin+3B[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-16 06:52:08
>>dekhn+U6
He didn't just say it wasn't going to work though, he told Elon to stick his submarine "where it hurts".

That said, Musk's comments were unnecessary.

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10. hndami+6F[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-16 07:20:45
>>jacque+Pb
The children were already safe at the time he made the comment.
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11. javajo+542[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-16 17:08:43
>>exodus+8c
I'm curious, what is the simple google search that will find this apology? And what's with accusing me of being a bot? That seems strange and off topic, and not a little unkind.
replies(1): >>exodus+GY3
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12. exodus+GY3[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-17 03:57:09
>>javajo+542
The simple google search might be "Elon Musk apologizes for ‘pedo guy’ comment".

It's strange you doubled-down on Musk not apologizing, when it was headline news at the time about his multiple apologies and statements of regret over the incident.

You stated: "honestly, I don't remember the details" yet proceeded at length with your analysis and judgement.

People have been using the new chat AI tools to post comments. Your comment was strangely drawn out, laboring on disjointed ideas, pressing inaccuracies like how the new bots do it.

replies(1): >>javajo+a44
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13. javajo+a44[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-17 04:46:17
>>exodus+GY3
I didn't double down. I asked. And yes, Musk apologized during the defamation trial. That's better than nothing, but not by much- he was under $150M of duress at that point. The vibe I got was distinctive, and softened, but not invalidated by this new information.
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14. hndami+Kf4[view] [source] [discussion] 2022-12-17 06:54:41
>>Raving+9c
Not his finest moment for sure, but it was proportionally retaliatory in context.
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