zlacker

I find the bigger problem is people can't understand that often there's just bad guys vs bad guys. Sure, Putin is an evil, murderous dictator who belongs in prison for the rest of his life.

Now, what should happen to Obama for committing the coup in Ukraine? He bragged about negotiating the coup before the previous leaders had to flee and the Assistant Secretary of State and Ukrainian ambassador were caught on tape talking about "midwifing this thing in" and making sure their hand-selected candidate became the leader.

I find there's nothing bad enough I can say about Putin that allows anyone to even consider any nuance.

>>Consul+(OP)
Sometimes it is just bad guys versus bad guys. I don't think that's the case here, but let's humor that argument. Good and bad isn't a simple binary - it's a scale. And I have yet to see an anti-Western narrative on the Ukraine war that doesn't use vastly different yardsticks of what is acceptable behavior for the West versus Russia.

>>Calava+C
That's a silly thing to say to someone who literally just said Putin is an evil, murderous dictator who deserves to be in prison for the rest of his life. Is there any level of condemnation I could give him that would allow you to have a discussion about the US role in this situation?

>>Consul+mh1
I don't think you understood my comment. It's not about how evil you or I think Putin is. It's about drawing false equivalencies.

Let's say for the sake of argument that Euromaidan was 100% manufactured by Obama. (I strongly disagree, but I'll give you that one for now.) A couple of hundred people died in the protests and riots. So far, by the Kremlin's own account, 100x to 200x that number have died in the 2022 invasion. Millions have been displaced. Entire towns and villages have been reduced to rubble. People are dying in Sri Lanka from famines because of the lack of Ukranian grain. How are you going to look anyone straight in the face and them that these evils are comparable?

This is what I mean when I say that every anti-Western narrative I've seen on this war uses different yardsticks for Russia and the West. Putin murdered 100 people? Well Obama killed 1 so it's really not that different is it? It's like asking a judge to give a thief who pocketed a candybar and a thief who robbed into a bank at gunpoint equal sentences because "both of them are thieves." I'd prefer not to have a thief as a roommate, but if my choices were a candybar thief or a bank robber, I know who I'd choose. You don't need a PhD in philosophy to understand this concept.

I'm am not sure if you are to arguing in bad faith or if you are sincere, but the drawing of false equivalencies is a favorite tool of those who argue in bad faith.

>>Calava+xp7
What do you think the US would do if Russia overthrew Mexico and started building up a military on our Southern border? Please refresh your memory on how close we were to total global annihilation during the Cuban missile crisis before responding.

Which country, in the last 30 years, has invaded more countries and killed more innocent people in wars of aggression? US or Russia?

Rank these world leaders in order of causing most innocent civilian deaths: Bush Jr, Obama, Trump, Biden, Putin.

Which country is providing the weapons for, providing intelligence, and coordinating strikes for Saudi Arabia's genocide in Yemen? US or Russia? How does the death count in Yemen compare to Ukraine?