zlacker

While I generally agree with your sentiment, some of the most iconic art in the world seems to me to be poorly made and I have no idea why they are valued or admired. I don’t just mean the usual go-to controversial examples in modern art like Serrano’s “Piss Christ”[0] or Emin’s “My Bed”[1], as even some older stuff like Klimt’s “Der Kuss”[2] give me this confusion (the woman has always looked to me like she has a broken neck).

(If it was just “I don’t like it” I would also list Cubism, but I can get that there are well-made examples of Cubism without liking the style).

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piss_Christ

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Bed

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Kiss_(Klimt)

>>ben_w+(OP)
The first two I would categorize more as anti-art (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-art). Modern art, which does include Klimt, is its own thing that is (relatively?) more traditional than those examples: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_art.

Anti-art is more like a sort of trolling meta commentary on art. The "performance art" of the art world, really. People who like it like it for the iconoclasm and/or humor of it, I think.

>>j4yav+J
I mean small-m modern, not the art style Modern. Synonym treadmill for words which mean “now-ish” being baked into specific periods, reminds me a bit of the meme of files called “Report_final_FINAL_2_feedback_final.doc” :)

>>ben_w+(OP)
I'm so used to The Kiss being a masterpiece out of the sheer force of its qualities (the passion, the reluctance, the dresses, the gold...) that I honestly struggle to see it from your point of view - she doesn't have a broken neck, she's "turtling" away from him. But i guess the eye of the beholder is what it is.

I do agree with your view of contemporary work though, it's hard to see the value of a lot of it (diamond skulls, broken mattresses, etc etc). Art has become an investment vehicle with a veneer of cultural education, so now the rulebook has gone out of the window.

>>ben_w+n1
Fair enough, worth mentioning still that contemporary art (the name for the period we're currently in) is also not all anti-art either.

>>ben_w+(OP)
>> It's astonishing to me that people will just buy into any success story that involves crypto and NFTs. People don't question why poorly drawn pictures are being bought for thousands of dollars

> While I generally agree with your sentiment, some of the most iconic art in the world seems to me to be poorly made and I have no idea why they are valued or admired. I don’t just mean modern art like Serrano’s “Piss Christ”[0] or Emin’s “My Bed”[1], but even some older stuff like Klimt’s “Der Kuss”[2] (the woman has always looked to me like she has a broken neck).

I don't think "Serrano’s “Piss Christ”[0] or Emin’s “My Bed”[1]" are in the category "most iconic art in the world." IIRC, most iconic art is such because of it's place in art history, and sometimes what looks poorly made actually required quite a lot of skill (e.g. if you try to flick paint on a canvas like Jackson Pollock did, it won't turn out). Sometimes skill requires skill to appreciate. Can someone who can't code appreciate the difference between good code that works and some spaghetti codes that also works?

I think the issue with NFT "poorly drawn pictures" is there's nothing special about them: not innovative, not influential, not especially pleasing, not made by anyone with any reputation (for art). Just common stuff that doesn't stand out from the crowd. Like a sibling comment said about modern art, NFTs are "an investment vehicle with a veneer of cultural education," without the veneer (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30285259).

>>ben_w+(OP)
Someone put something in piss 35 years ago and you're still talking about it now instead of whatever form of art you think is superior. Sounds iconic.

>>ben_w+(OP)
Well, you just burst our family bubble. By random chance I clicked your last link and saw... the painting my wife has had hanging prominently, horizontally, for years and neither of us questioned that it was an original work by a local artist. It looked just... "meh" enough for me to believe it. Also, I don't know much about art.

>>thrwyo+t3
It is iconic as a sort of meme, people always mention it when they want to say that they don't like any art produced in the last few hundred years.

>>ben_w+(OP)
Silver Car Crash by Warhol sold for a 105 million dollars and it is just a screen print of a car crash.

https://www.sothebys.com/en/videos/preview-silver-car-crash-...

Honestly, I can't imagine Warhol would not be involved in NFTs if he was alive.

I think NFTs are beyond stupid but so is 75% of the art in a modern gallery.

In 1987 in a far more Christian society, you can see how Piss Christ is going to make noise.