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1. menset+(OP)[view] [source] 2021-05-07 12:32:30
“ It later turned out that the Lancet letter had been organized and drafted by Peter Daszak, president of the EcoHealth Alliance of New York. Daszak’s organization funded coronavirus research at the Wuhan Institute of Virology. If the SARS2 virus had indeed escaped from research he funded, Daszak would be potentially culpable. This acute conflict of interest was not declared to the Lancet’s readers. To the contrary, the letter concluded, “We declare no competing interests.””

This is news to me. Wtf?

replies(3): >>AzzieE+E >>kossTK+Om >>Izkata+9A3
2. AzzieE+E[view] [source] 2021-05-07 12:37:59
>>menset+(OP)
I read Josh Rogin earlier articles on the subject. He also recently implicated Fauchi for covertly funding gain of function research, and he is pushing for congressional oversight/investigation https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/cong...
replies(2): >>newacc+A1 >>pclmul+X1
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3. newacc+A1[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 12:47:36
>>AzzieE+E
> He also recently implicated Fauchi for covertly funding gain of function research

I'm sorry, that essay (which is an opinion piece, not a work of investigative journalism) says absolutely nothing of the sort. What's your source on that? That's a pretty ridiculous accusation if you don't have evidence.

replies(2): >>AzzieE+l4 >>rastap+Nyt
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4. pclmul+X1[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 12:51:02
>>AzzieE+E
Fauci and his close colleagues (including the current head of the CDC) were ardent proponents of gain of function research, and funded gain of function research at the WIV to the tune of millions of dollars.

Didn't anybody think it was weird that the head of the NIH, a research institution, not a public health institution, became the top public health communicator during COVID instead of the heads of the CDC? He had a massive conflict of interest and wanted to protect it.

replies(2): >>Consul+F2 >>gruez+n4
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5. Consul+F2[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 12:56:40
>>pclmul+X1
There will be no consequences for the people involved. There will be none for Fauci or anyone in the Trump/Biden administrations for allowing and not disclosing this loudly. None for the corporate press who did no journalism whatsoever. No consequences for anyone.
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6. AzzieE+l4[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 13:09:32
>>newacc+A1
Rogin covers this in his book “Chaos under heaven” and his earlier articles. Here is Rogan/Rogin snippet https://youtu.be/IqhKlkkc2Eo
replies(2): >>newacc+Qk >>guesst+vr1
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7. gruez+n4[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 13:09:38
>>pclmul+X1
>Didn't anybody think it was weird that the head of the NIH, a research institution, not a public health institution, became the top public health communicator during COVID instead of the heads of the CDC? He had a massive conflict of interest and wanted to protect it.

1. How does being the "top public health communicator" protect his conflict of interest?

2. Fauci isn't the head of the NIH, his position was "Director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases"

3. Sure, it might sound weird, but what does previous pandemics show? Who was "top public health communicator" during the previous pandemics?

replies(1): >>pclmul+5n
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8. newacc+Qk[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 14:43:35
>>AzzieE+l4
You're saying that Rogin reported that Anthony Fauci "covertly funded gain of function research", and that this fact (which constitutes an absolute blockbuster story) wasn't reported or corroborated anywhere in journalism, by an author who's everywhere in print and on TV but who somehow never said this in public, and the only linkable source is a podcast?

Yeah, this didn't happen.

replies(1): >>AzzieE+mo
9. kossTK+Om[view] [source] 2021-05-07 14:53:45
>>menset+(OP)
Exactly, the fact that people continue discussing China as some absurdly isolated exotic entity completely ignore the EcoHealth smoking gun - and the fact the USA is the ruling empire with their hands in absolutely everything including Chinese capitalism, military and trade.

No matter how much posturing and geopolitical theatre is going the same fragmented transnational elite is continuing actual resource oriented realpolitics completely outside of the narratives presented in the media that is owned by this class.

Whatever the purspose of this gain of function research is - it's not even discussed in MSM media even though you can go read the docs right out in the open. Same with the EMA bird flu pharma scandal that no one talks about these day that just happened 10 years ago.

Regarding the research it seems it's obviously not about bilateral war, as both complexes in China and the US is "in on it", could be everything from a push towards surveillance, depopulation, centralisation to stock manipulation. Who knows, when there is seemingly no actual research journalists left. The ones who do question things, are quickly removed from Google, banned from Twitter and deleted from Facebook.

Actual oldschool journalism today will make you a "conspiracy theorist" by todays standards because a small minority of people are stupid and being actively misled. Dystopian!

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10. pclmul+5n[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 14:55:02
>>gruez+n4
1. It protects his conflicts of interest by allowing him to routinely dismiss things like the lab leak hypothesis and control the narrative around the virus and its vaccines. It has allowed him to shape public policy in a way that deflects responsibility away from himself and his friends.

2. I was wrong. Wikipedia shows that the NIAID is part of the NIH. Still a research organization, not a public health organization.

3. Previous outbreaks, such as Ebola, SARS, MERS, etc. have _all_ been spearheaded by the CDC. The CDC is the branch of government responsible for managing disease outbreaks. The CDC head is therefore the "top public health communicator." It's worth noting that being a "communicator" here is much more than about talking to the public; it's also about who talks to the politicians.

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11. AzzieE+mo[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 15:01:16
>>newacc+Qk
this is fascinating. Rogin is making the claim right before your eyes and your conclusion is that he doesn't mean it because he never printed it?
replies(1): >>newacc+ru
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12. newacc+ru[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 15:39:09
>>AzzieE+mo
He's literally not. I don't have the book, your other link is a podcast. And (this is the really important part) literally no one else, not even Breitbart or conservative link farms who would slurp this up like candy, is reporting that Rogin said it.

So I choose to believe that you're just wrong about what he said. Again, Fauci covertly directing funds to an area of research that the medical community has recognized as ethically problematic for decades would be huge news. And all you have is a podcast? Seriously?

replies(3): >>AzzieE+9J >>kansfa+X01 >>MockOb+L11
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13. AzzieE+9J[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 16:51:18
>>newacc+ru
Thank you for this fascinating insight into a stranger’s decision making process. I am not being ironic
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14. kansfa+X01[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 18:23:20
>>newacc+ru
As claimed by Rogin, the medical research community is privately divided but largely unwilling to speak out publicly because they don’t want to be labeled conspiracy theorists, don’t want to be associated with supporting a position tangentially aligned with trump, and first and foremost don’t want to jeopardize their grants or careers.

According to Rogin, Fauci did not so much covertly direct funds, but rather, quietly reinstated gain a function research which was stopped by the Obama administration (without approval from the Trump administration). He also doubled down with new grants in the same area as a response to the pandemic.

I personally find none of this particularly difficult to believe given other positions the medical establishment has taken over the coarse of the pandemic and the extreme lack of curiosity in the press.

replies(1): >>newacc+Ql3
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15. MockOb+L11[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 18:26:38
>>newacc+ru
Are you taking issue with the word "covertly", or the statement that Fauci's NIAID funded GoF research? Because the latter is also claimed directly in the OP.
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16. guesst+vr1[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 20:50:07
>>AzzieE+l4
You shouldn't have used the word "covertly". That completely distorted your point and made it false.

I watched the Joe Rogan Josh Rogin clip you linked to. It's very interesting. But what Rogin says is that Fauci "found a way to turn gain-of-function research back on". He doesn't say that Fauci did anything covertly. He's describing effective bureaucratic maneuvering, which Fauci must be good at. He couldn't have stayed in his job for decades otherwise.

"Covert" means something very different, for example if he had taken money that was assigned to different research, funneled it to gain-of-function labs, and then falsified reports about how the money was spent. Some outrageous scenario like that is what you're implying with that word. Rogin implies nothing of the sort. Actually, from the facts in the OP article, which are drawn from public reports, it's clear Fauci got what he wanted overtly. That's how effective bureaucrats get things done.

By overstating the claim, you distracted from the significant thing, which is that Fauci was a major funder of gain-of-function research and, in the dispute between virologists about whether it was too risky or not, was strongly on the side that advocated for it. The other side managed to get the research shut down for a while, and then Fauci managed to get it turned back on. There's no suggestion or evidence that he did so in bad faith, as Rogin is careful to point out. But it does mean that he has a conflict of interest in dismissing the lab leak hypothesis, just like Daszak does. That's already a very strong point, and a lot for people to take. If you say that it was "covert" on top of that, you're acting like the very conspiracy theorist they want to tell everyone you are, and helpfully providing them with a bit that is easily debunked.

replies(2): >>AzzieE+GF1 >>newacc+GX2
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17. AzzieE+GF1[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-07 22:36:30
>>guesst+vr1
good point, I am not a native English speaker and let things like these slip time to time.
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18. newacc+GX2[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-08 12:32:15
>>guesst+vr1
> By overstating the claim, you distracted from the significant thing, which is that Fauci was a major funder of gain-of-function research

I'm sorry, but I've been digging and I just don't see any major justification here. I'm sure there's subtlety, but there's just no one in the research world coming out to say this. There are no accusations being made. There's no memo with his name on it. There's no specific study cited that he pushed. There's nothing. No one is covering this.

This is just the next conspiracy theory, isn't it? It's not falsifiable, so everyone is going to believe it anyway. This is how we got Q. You're doing it again.

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19. newacc+Ql3[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-08 15:34:16
>>kansfa+X01
> the medical research community is privately divided but largely unwilling to speak out publicly because they don’t want to be labeled conspiracy theorists

So there's a hidden truth that happens to confirm the priors of a bunch of highly-on-the-internet people, but without any evidence in public. And the fact that the evidence doesn't exist is being cited as an argument that it must exist because of asserted suppression.

Well, for sure someone's going to be labelled as a conspiracy theorist. Seriously: it doesn't surprise you that the same folks that were so into Q a few months back are suddenly all aflutter with this omg-Fauci-created-covid nonsense?

replies(1): >>kansfa+ZI8
20. Izkata+9A3[view] [source] 2021-05-08 17:11:02
>>menset+(OP)
It's nice to see some of this is finally getting out in a way people are willing to look at, rather than just dismiss as "conspiracy theory" out of hand. Like others have said, none of this is new, it's just that people are finally willing to look - and there's more to see.

For example, here's another one of those odd coincidences that gets easily dismissed as a conspiracy theory: September 2019 there was a pandemic wargame called "Outbreak 2019", specifically based around an infectious disease that causes respiratory failure.

https://www.military.com/daily-news/2020/04/01/naval-war-col...

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21. kansfa+ZI8[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-10 17:45:19
>>newacc+Ql3
> And the fact that the evidence doesn't exist is being cited as an argument that it must exist because of asserted suppression.

No, its not "the fact that it doesn't exist" that lends credence to existence. The incentives involved for everyone who ostensibly would look for its existence align to have them look the other way. Given other circumstantial evidence, that is suspicious!

> Seriously: it doesn't surprise you that the same folks that were so into Q a few months back are suddenly all aflutter with this omg-Fauci-created-covid nonsense?

As near as I can tell, your argument here is: create a crazy conspiracy theory, attribute it to Rogin, point to the conspiracy theory as proof that Rogin is crazy. No one in this thread nor Rogin have claimed that Fauci literally created the corona virus. The claims are 1. Fuaci is a proponent of research that Obama shut down because its of little value and dangerous, 2. a lab in china with shit opsec was doing the same research on corona viruses which happened to be where the outbreak started, 3. Fauci re-instituted the research program under Trump without input from the Trump administration.

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22. rastap+Nyt[view] [source] [discussion] 2021-05-17 21:43:28
>>newacc+A1
Here's the direct discussion between Rand Paul and Fauci on this topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkE_mw6bRcg
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