zlacker

Where do you live? I have no idea what it's like to be Jewish but I have Jewish friends and have had Jewish bosses. I couldn't tell them apart from any other white people in the area. If they hadn't told me they were Jewish I'd never have known nor cared. I certainly didn't treat them different.

At what point are we all just different? I can't meet people that are into my particular hobby. I also go to clubs and bars from time to time and never feel like "these are my people". Even going to game dev events (since I do game dev) a rarely feel like "these are my people".

>>gfxgir+(OP)
I think it's very subtle stuff, an example may be having kosher food being the default.

When living in Singapore, I used to make the faux pas of mixing together Muslim food (no pork), Indian food (no beef) and Chinese food (lots of pork/beef) together.

>>SenHen+Bj
You meant you mixed them on your plate? Or you just confused them?

I don't think the former is faux pas. Just a bit weird. The latter seems like a hard mistake to make (I live in Singapore), but I guess it's possible, especially if you have no local guidance.

>>gfxgir+(OP)
Christmas feels weird to me -- It feels vaguely exclusive.

>>jsharf+fu
I mean no offense by this, but the jewish experience in America doesn't compare to the black experience. In 99% of cases you are just another white person.

>>seppin+kz
It has to be said that, by all accounts, this didn't use to be the case until about WWII. But yeah, like all "white" minorities, Jews were eventually freed of the stigma. Obviously that's not the case for others.

>>seppin+kz
What do you mean by "black experience"? I'm not used to American culture and I have heard this expression several times. Is it only a skin-color thing or does "black" mean a different culture/tradition? I mean, if a black baby is raised by white parents on a 100% white neighborhood, will he live the black experience? Conversely, if a white baby is raised by black parents on a 100% black neighborhood, will he live the black experience? I honestly do not understand some of the anti-racist discourse (which I generally agree with), because sometimes people speak as if "black" was a distinct culture, not a race (and thus, independent from the racial issue, allowing for people of any skin color to be part or not of this culture).

>>jsharf+fu
Christmas is really for everyone, it is about Santa Claus bringing gifts and Coca Cola polar bears. No need to feel excluded.

>>spoopy+MT
Well, it's about the Messiah being born, be it was culturally appropriated (ceded?).

Despite what social media and talk radio says, most Christians are fine others enjoying a non-Christian Christmas as long as it's being used in an uplifting way. Definitely no need to feel excluded.

>>gfxgir+(OP)
So in America in the 21st century, white Jews are treated pretty much like any other white person. I would say that there are some subtle cultural things that make me feel a bit "other", though. For example, sports teams called the "Crusaders": In the Jewish collective memory, the Crusades were an awful time. Crusaders rampaged through many Jewish communities, murdering many thousand of Jewish people and destroying the Jewish communities in several cities (cf. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhineland_massacres, among others). There are historical records of Jews committing suicide in anticipation of the Crusaders reaching their cities. Hearing about basketball teams called "The Crusaders" really surprised me -- did these people not know what the Crusaders did?

>>gfxgir+(OP)
I am also Jewish, but people don't know unless I tell them 99% of the time. The only time I feel "different" is when from time to time people say incredibly anti Semitic things to me not realizing what my background is. It's usually near strangers and really jarring. This also happens with my sexuality (gay), so I've just sort of accepted it. I do code switch, I don't use any "jewish" words in random situations and I shift my natural speaking pitch down to sound "straight". It's been my reality for so long that it just automatically happens now. I think we are all different, but certain differences have a lot more stigma attached to them and it shapes the way you view and interact with the world. I also do not feel like I'm with my "people" in interest groups.

>>bkande+D11
The Crusades were also a response to Arab invasions into Europe, during a time when Vienna, practically the center of Europe, was besieged twice by the Ottomans, and the entire Iberian peninsula was conquered and held for more than half a millennium by Muslims (and Constantinople/Istanbul still is). Many border countries had children regularly kidnapped into slavery by Ottoman raids (or had to turn them over as part of the blood tax), then turned into child soldiers and made to participate in those same raids, so try to understand when not everyone shares your black and white view of crusaders.

Look at it this way - complaining about the Crusades makes as much sense as complaining about Purim, which celebrates 75 thousand Persians being pre-emptively killed for being "enemies of the Jews".

>>enriqu+lP
Yes my friend who is black who lives in a big house in a rich area gets pulled over by the police at least once a month and harassed.

Her upbringing and class doesn't matter.

This is common: https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/02/us/chris-rock-pulled-over-pol...

>>What_w+d12
The Ottomans existed centuries _after_ the crusades, timing the raids and the Vienna sieges after the crusaded. Does time work different where you life?

>>gfxgir+(OP)
I live in NC. Judaism is more than just a religion. For many jews, it's part of their identity. That makes it different than going to clubs and bars or game dev events. It's a sense of exclusion that I feel at times, especially being in the bible belt.

I've never had any particularly anti-semitic things happen to me, just a few minor incidents. But anti-semitism still happens to jews, and that affects me. For example, after the Pittsburgh synagogue shooting a couple years ago, my temple had to hire an off-duty police officer during our high holiday services so that temple members would feel safe. I have family members who attended the Pittsburgh temple.

My mother experienced anti-semitism growing up in NJ that is part of her psyche to this day such that she's not comfortable wearing any jewish symbols.

This is nothing like the black experience, and I don't mean to say that it is. But it gives me some empathy for what it must feel like to be marginalized, to be different.

That is all I was trying to say.

>>bkande+D11
> So in America in the 21st century, white Jews are treated pretty much like any other white person.

No, that's just not true. Yes, we have the privilege of being white. But hate crimes still happen to Jews. America still caters to Christians.

>>seppin+kz
I'm certainly not trying to compare the two at all. But I can think about times I've been treated as an "other" or not catered to because I'm not the majority and draw empathy from that.