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1. Barrin+(OP)[view] [source] 2020-05-29 23:05:34
>So, what specifically is it that we don't like about this situation?

The ongoing militarization of state level police forces without the democratic consent of the governed for a start?

replies(2): >>Alupis+M3 >>rayine+Hb
2. Alupis+M3[view] [source] 2020-05-29 23:33:32
>>Barrin+(OP)
> democratic consent of the governed

Just playing devil's advocate - but this is democratically consented to.

Your elected politicians have specifically allowed the sale or transfer of retired military equipment to state and local police forces, for multiple reasons but the least-of-which was cost savings vs. scrapping all the prepaid equipment.

Similar, but admittedly not quite the same, to the sale of demilitarized Humvees, tanks and fighter jets to civilians. Or NASA owning and operating former US Navy F/A-18's, B-52's and more... war machines now repurposed for peaceful training and aeronautical research.

replies(1): >>Barrin+k9
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3. Barrin+k9[view] [source] [discussion] 2020-05-30 00:22:05
>>Alupis+M3
Yeah in the same sense of how we all democratically opted in to mass surveillance or encryption breaking. Let's be honest the people who are at the receiving end of this technology haven't been democratically decided anything in a long time. What this actually is, is what Sheldon Wolin called inverted totalitarianism and when it comes to these police measures that's not even an exaggeration.

Just as a random question, how many people do you think know that these guys (https://longreads.com/2019/06/21/nothing-kept-me-up-at-night...) are flying above American cities

replies(1): >>Alupis+ja
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4. Alupis+ja[view] [source] [discussion] 2020-05-30 00:30:24
>>Barrin+k9
The solution is to vote-out the out-of-touch career politicians then, no?

I have a suspicion, being a Senator for 40 years sort of removes you from the concerns of everyday Americans.

These are the same Senators (and Representatives) that vote for these measures. They'll never be the target of these surveillance schemes... and when they are, they throw a huge fit[1] because they're supposedly above all of it. They're the same people who ban guns from the public, but own operate and illegally traffic them themselves[2].

They're the same ones that don't have to be strip searched every time they fly, but I digress...

[1] https://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2014/03/13/pelosi-alle...

[2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/02/2...

replies(1): >>rayine+bc
5. rayine+Hb[view] [source] 2020-05-30 00:41:25
>>Barrin+(OP)
> The ongoing militarization of state level police forces without the democratic consent of the governed for a start?

Are you living in the same country as me? The “governed” love this stuff, and keep voting for the people that do it. Civil liberties has always been something that has to be achieved through anti-democratic means.

replies(1): >>Barrin+zd
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6. rayine+bc[view] [source] [discussion] 2020-05-30 00:45:21
>>Alupis+ja
It’s not clear to me that the Senators voting for this aren’t similarly situated to “everyday Americans.” Remember when armed civilians stormed the Michigan Capitol and nothing happened? They aren’t politically connected, etc. Maybe the folks who keep electing these senators correctly perceive that the power of the state won’t be used against them, so long as they belong to the majority.
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7. Barrin+zd[view] [source] [discussion] 2020-05-30 01:03:57
>>rayine+Hb
Yeah don't get me wrong I'm well aware that there's a lot of public support for it. I meant the governed in the narrow sense here, the communities who are actually affected (and largely segregated).

Same goes for the policing. The amount of separation between the police and the policed, demographically, politically and so on is hard to defend.

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