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1. Aloha+(OP)[view] [source] 2018-01-19 03:50:40
If people would stop conflating poverty with racism, I think we'd have a better chance is solving both.

Poor people, regardless of color, have a remarkably similar experience (with education, the police, the criminal justice system), while yes, people of color are more likely to be poor - the harder we focus on race, the harder it is to fix the underlying issue, a lack of educational, and economic mobility for the poor.

Most racism (heck, most "-isms" in general), are born from a lack of familiarity with people who come from a different life background or culture than they do - if we both encourage opportunity for the poor, and encourage mixing of socioeconomic strata, the problem will melt away over 40-50 years.

The racism that will remain after solving poverty, will be of a very different nature I believe than that which exists now.

It's dangerous to fall for the trap that you can adjust for outcomes - but we can do a far better job of adjusting for inputs - or ensuring the poor have equal access to education, and economic opportunity.

replies(1): >>zasz+s3
2. zasz+s3[view] [source] 2018-01-19 04:56:08
>>Aloha+(OP)
> Poor people, regardless of color, have a remarkably similar experience (with education, the police, the criminal justice system)

That's not true. Google "red-lining." Black people face considerable housing discrimination that white people simply do not. Studies have also shown that people of color face longer prison sentences for the same crimes. It is false to say that all poor people have the same experiences.

replies(4): >>Aloha+M3 >>brucep+K4 >>mpweih+E8 >>soupro+612
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3. Aloha+M3[view] [source] [discussion] 2018-01-19 05:05:19
>>zasz+s3
as it so happens, people who are not poor, can afford lawyers - part of fixing poverty is improving access to the legal system for the impoverished.

You are absolutely right that black folks face longer jail terms than white folks for the same crime - but we still need to fix poverty - we can work on this on its own, or after - removing poverty will greatly reduce the amount of crime anyhow, most of which is driven by a need to survive and lack of opportunity.

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4. brucep+K4[view] [source] [discussion] 2018-01-19 05:21:34
>>zasz+s3
You're correct, but would you agree that poverty is a better predictor for hardship in the USA than race?

In other words, would you agree that a poor white person has a much harder life than a rich black person?

Having much experience with both demographics, it's clear to me that this is the case, which is why I also wish the conversation were focused more on poverty than race.

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5. mpweih+E8[view] [source] [discussion] 2018-01-19 06:44:13
>>zasz+s3
> people of color face longer prison sentences for the same crimes

Yep. And yet the same effect exists for men (vs. women) and is about six times as strong. Yet our society is "obviously" sexist against women.

https://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_g...

'After controlling for the arrest offense, criminal history, and other prior characteristics, "men receive 63% longer sentences on average than women do," and "[w]omen are…twice as likely to avoid incarceration if convicted." This gender gap is about six times as large as the racial disparity that Prof. Starr found in another recent paper.'

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6. soupro+612[view] [source] [discussion] 2018-01-20 02:46:52
>>zasz+s3
All of that has been illegal for many decades. At some point, you have to stop holding a grudge for the sins of long-gone people who happen to look sort of similar to some other people.
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