zlacker

[return to "Amazon fires two UX designers critical of warehouse working conditions"]
1. cirno+0y[view] [source] 2020-04-14 19:10:44
>>claude+(OP)
> “We support every employee’s right to criticize their employer’s working conditions,” a spokesperson said, “but that does not come with blanket immunity against any and all internal policies.”

What a strange statement. "We support their right to criticize their working conditions, only actually we don't at all"

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2. NotSam+rQ[view] [source] 2020-04-14 20:52:58
>>cirno+0y
Why is amazon so clueless. These firings seems like bad policy, seem to be very likely illegal (they have so much money it won't matter though to pay fines). And it's terrible PR. And for people that pay attention (including hacker news people) it makes them look terrible.

Four bad outcomes. All they do is "remove a troublemaker" from their standpoint. Why not just address the issues? They look like they want to bring back the days of company towns and central control. This doesn't make me want to work there, it's a strong dis-incentive for that.

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3. rglull+ZQ[view] [source] 2020-04-14 20:56:59
>>NotSam+rQ
Forget about working there. Does it stop you from buying their products?
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4. maland+321[view] [source] 2020-04-14 21:59:53
>>rglull+ZQ
This.

It doesn't really matter what Amazon does (see this comment https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22871216), the woke crowd has already made up their mind about the company and will criticize them regardless. The only thing that is going to satisfy the woke crowd is Amazon's failure.

Their best strategy is to focus on being the most customer centric company so that people like myself and millions upon millions of others keep buying from them.

I worked at another company the woke crowd loved to hate on and no matter how much more actual woke stuff our company did, the woke crowd still promoted the less woke company with the more woke brand because we were Goliath and they were David. We should have stopped wasting our effort to appease the unappeasable and just focused on being customer-centric like Amazon does. The loudest critics aren't trying to build a better world. They are trying to signal to others about how woke they want others to think they are.

This doesn't mean that Amazon and my previous employer shouldn't do good things. They should and do. What it means is that they should do it because those things are the right thing and they should pay no mind to the haters because haters are gonna hate. You can't be Goliath and not get hated on.

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5. wolco+Uh1[view] [source] 2020-04-15 00:14:05
>>maland+321
Let me guess you worked at Uber and Lyft was the darling?

Not sure treating employees badly makes for a better world. Perhaps more profit at the top makes for a better world for some.

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6. maland+mi1[view] [source] 2020-04-15 00:17:51
>>wolco+Uh1
Nope. I worked at a different company.

This isn't even about people at the top. When everyone is on the same team and owns equity in that collective endeavor, someone that goes outside to publicly bad mouth the team is hurting everyone on their team. That's some Grade-A anti-social behavior. I'm an IC and far from the top, but I never want to work with such people who use righteous indignation to justify their anti-social actions.

These two people are two nobodies who took it upon themselves to be the arbiters of judgement and instead of checking with their colleagues to see if their views were collectively aligned with the consensus of their colleagues. They should be asking themselves "AITA?". If you are whipping up public outrage that hurts your colleagues without validating if there is consensus among your colleagues, the answer to that question is unequivocal "yes".

“The surest way to work up a crusade in favor of some good cause is to promise people they will have a chance of maltreating someone. To be able to destroy with good conscience, to be able to behave badly and call your bad behavior 'righteous indignation' — this is the height of psychological luxury, the most delicious of moral treats.” ― Aldous Huxley, Crome Yellow

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7. sizzle+sS1[view] [source] 2020-04-15 06:58:20
>>maland+mi1
Your post can be summed up with the general truism: "don't bite the hand that feeds you".

"These two people are two nobodies who took it upon themselves to be the arbiters of judgement and instead of checking with their colleagues to see if their views were collectively aligned with the consensus of their colleagues."

The article stated a thousand Amazon employees accepted the event invite before it was deleted by management, which goes without saying that they had enough group interest internally to warrant the event... which is within the purview of their already established employee interest group.

Source: Amazon Employees For Climate Justice @AMZNforClimate We're a group of Amazon employees who believe it’s our responsibility to ensure our business models don’t contribute to the climate crisis. Views ≠ Amazon.

https://twitter.com/AMZNforclimate

These employees are only guilty of voicing their dissent publicly and running afoul of corporate PR policy. We are all entitled to voicing our opinions and beliefs and rallying around a cause individuals are passionate about e.g. climate change impact, Google ending military/China contracts, etc. The unfortunate way I've seen this play out is that at-will employment means an employer is free to sever your relationship at any time with them and can do so under the cloak of bad performance, violating company policy, etc. and it will be an uphill battle to prove retaliation in court when they have the best legal team money can buy. Best to be prepared to look for employment elsewhere if you are organizing a group event to expose your employer to negative PR when on their payroll.

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8. mercer+Ef2[view] [source] 2020-04-15 12:01:19
>>sizzle+sS1
you're replying to what I've marked as a right-wing brazilian. In my experience these types glorify even the Trumpian America and don't have any awareness of their local issues because they're 'middle class' and never have to interact with any brazilians beneath them, as all those other brazilians just never put in the effort.

I'd love to be proven wrong though.

FWIW: my experience with Brazilian Google-employees is that their lives are shockingly insulated from the rest of the country. home -> car -> guarded parking -> <entertainment> -> home. we admittedly privileged expats got to experience more than them even, at times!

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