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U.S. government takes 10% stake in Intel

submitted by giveme+(OP) on 2025-08-22 21:01:52 | 610 points 713 comments
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10. voxada+k4[view] [source] 2025-08-22 21:29:23
>>giveme+(OP)
Intel press release:

https://newsroom.intel.com/corporate/intel-and-trump-adminis...

41. miohta+77[view] [source] 2025-08-22 21:44:38
>>giveme+(OP)
Discussion from yesterday about Intel's and Trump's woes

>>44978356

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63. threem+H8[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 21:53:27
>>naijab+e4
The Republican party of 2008 bears little resemblance to the one of 2025, especially on economic issues. Many in the party have changed their views over the last decade+ on industrial policy and the libertarian wing of the party has very little influence now. It's really a striking shift.

What remains of the "old guard" is, in fact, loudly complaining about this move:

https://www.nationalreview.com/2025/08/the-government-should...

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86. kragen+Ca[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 22:06:27
>>Yoofie+u9
I'm surprised to see on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_Technology that Microchip does in fact have fabs. I thought it was fabless! Its fabs are in the US, but the assembly and test facilities are all across the Pacific.
118. righth+jc[view] [source] 2025-08-22 22:16:57
>>giveme+(OP)
Trying to ignore the politicking on this so it can be clear on what exactly is “happening”.

As far as I understand, all Trump did was alter Biden admin’s original plan. Trump swapped a 10% stake in Intel for Biden’s profit sharing for participating in the grants[0] (anyone who participates in the CHIPS Act gets this deal currently, I guess Intel is renegotiating). Not necessarily better or worse because Intel is a long ways away from any sort of gain that would make a difference.

If you feel conflicted to think this is a good or bad move, you’re right where Trump wants you. Sit down and do the napkin math, you may find the deal irrelevant or numbers similar. In the end we won’t know for a decade the result. The move is meaningless financially but generates headlines and doesn’t do anything to advance the actual foundries.

It’s almost distracting…

[0] “Biden to require chips companies winning subsidies to share excess profits“ >> https://www.reuters.com/technology/us-require-companies-winn...

131. banku_+ed[view] [source] 2025-08-22 22:22:30
>>giveme+(OP)
[Ex Post Facto Clause, US Constitution](https://www.congress.gov/crs-product/IF11293). Oops, I thought it was so obviously going to be done away with in the courts, but in 1912 the Supreme Court ruled that it applies only to criminal punishments.

They always getcha with the fine print.

153. rvz+je[view] [source] 2025-08-22 22:28:09
>>giveme+(OP)
Yet another bailout from the US government as accurately predicted. [0]

[0] >>44676641

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167. Thrymr+Ze[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 22:31:24
>>lawles+x3
As of last week: https://bsky.app/profile/unusualwhales.bsky.social/post/3lwf...
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199. andsoi+pg[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 22:40:45
>>sobiol+da
Western governments have taken a stake in, nationalised, or owned / operated corporations for a very long time!

Some examples: VOC, BBC, national airlines, etc.

List across countries: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_government-owned_compa...

US specific: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State-owned_enterprises_of_the...

207. akozak+Yg[view] [source] 2025-08-22 22:44:50
>>giveme+(OP)
A lot of people are commenting on this without reading the actual content of the deal, which is spelled out in Intel's press release: https://www.intc.com/news-events/press-releases/detail/1748/...
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223. userno+ji[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 22:53:33
>>MyOutf+V6
The clearer picture comes from Reuters[0], as usual:

>The government will purchase the 433.3 million shares with funding from the $5.7 billion in unpaid CHIPS Act grants and $3.2 billion awarded to Intel for the Secure Enclave program.

So the same playbook hes taken across the board: cast aspersions on leadership, withhold duly appropriated money in contravention to the law. Rinse repeat.

[0]: https://www.reuters.com/business/trump-says-intel-has-agreed...

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243. Walter+Qj[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:04:51
>>JackYo+Wi
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solyndra

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CHIPS_and_Science_Act

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245. signat+4k[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:06:49
>>sobiol+da
You need to study history. US government is no stranger in getting stakes in businesses. Did you already forget the Great Depression?

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/economics/08/governmen...

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297. scarfa+Pn[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:33:14
>>charli+1n
And it’s still owned by a foreign country and Taiwan is restricting TSMC from manufacturing their most advanced processors from being manufactured in the US.

https://www.tomshardware.com/tech-industry/semiconductors/ta...

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299. wahern+1o[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:35:02
>>cvoss+z8
> Can somebody explain to me how the government made an investement, bought shares, but paid nothing?

Extortion.

Recent Supreme Court decisions have permitted the government to unilaterally cancel disbursements, even in flagrant violation of the plain text of law, impervious to preliminary injunctions, and then put up procedural hurdles to significantly increase the cost of reaching a final judgment in favor of the plaintiff. See, e.g., the most recent decisions issued this week in National Institutes of Health v. American Public Health Assn.: https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/relatingtoorders/24

So presumably the administration's deal was, give us what we ask for and you'll get the money Congress awarded, or don't and wait 1-2 years for any case to wind its way through the courts.

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302. onetim+8o[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:36:57
>>miohta+p8
This is my thought on it too. I don't think this is meant to be a political win so much as US intelligence views chip manufacturing extremely strategically. I also don't know about what will happen to TSMC. But the US has been pushing for US made GPUs as well. This goes back to Biden's admin as well.

https://www.tomshardware.com/tech-industry/us-govt-pushes-nv...

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314. devinp+4p[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:44:18
>>ivewon+sn
That's interesting example to choose, as I've actually heard often that the Social Security administration is an example of an efficient government administration.

For example, a quick Google search shows administrative overhead as around 0.5% of benefits: https://www.cbpp.org/research/social-security/top-ten-facts-...

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319. kaladi+ep[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:44:58
>>fishgo+v8
From my vague understanding I thought that Hygon is able to build atop Zen 1 IP that AMD gave Hygon, although they can't get anything newer because of restrictions on doing business with China.

Hygon still seems to be making x86 CPUs: https://www.techpowerup.com/336529/hygon-prepares-128-core-5....

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321. kragen+ip[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:45:06
>>JustEx+km
Right, AMD sold off their foundry business as GlobalFoundries in 02009 to the Mubadala sovereign wealth fund of the UAE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GlobalFoundries

The others would probably be GlobalFoundries, Micron, Microchip, and TI.

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325. tomsto+fq[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-22 23:51:17
>>JackYo+4j
"Air America was an American passenger and cargo airline established in 1946 and covertly owned and operated by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) from 1950 to 1976."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_America_(airline)

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379. bko+qy[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 01:01:03
>>Obscur+js
Not that I agree with bail-outs, but 2008 financial crisis that resulted in a number of bail outs actually netted the treasury a profit.

> In total, U.S. government economic bailouts related to the 2008 financial crisis had federal outflows (expenditures, loans, and investments) of $633.6 billion and inflows (funds returned to the Treasury as interest, dividends, fees, or stock warrant repurchases) of $754.8 billion, for a net profit of $121 billion

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troubled_Asset_Relief_Program

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388. anigbr+Yz[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 01:14:11
>>jimt12+I8
Here's some emergency reading

https://theupheaval.substack.com/p/its-not-hypocrisy-youre-j...

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394. vel0ci+dB[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 01:26:16
>>mempko+Em
You're wrong because it wasn't some bailout it was a normal government loan available to to a wide range of companies. I'm not Tesla stan but it's massively misrepresenting the loan to call it a bailout. It's the kind of market investing the government should be doing, underwriting somewhat riskier loans to push the envelope on technology.

https://www.energy.gov/lpo/advanced-technology-vehicles-manu...

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399. ivewon+VB[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 01:32:36
>>devinp+4p
Just one instance.

https://fedscoop.com/problem-project-threatens-progress-soci...

> The program, called the Disability Case Processing System, or DCPS, was designed to improve case processing and enhance customer service. But six years and $288 million later the program has “delivered limited functionality and faced schedule delays as well as increasing stakeholder concerns

For the main system they're still using COBOL, which has no Date data type, causing issues even in 2025.

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401. ivewon+0C[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 01:33:32
>>cybera+jw
If it was a company it'd have failed already.

> The program, called the Disability Case Processing System, or DCPS, was designed to improve case processing and enhance customer service. But six years and $288 million later the program has “delivered limited functionality and faced schedule delays as well as increasing stakeholder concerns

https://fedscoop.com/problem-project-threatens-progress-soci...

And that's just one instance.

Can you imagine raising $288 million from VCs for a software application while delivering so little?

But taxpayer money? Free and easy money to keep wasting coz no one cares. Tragedy of the commons.

For the main system they're also using COBOL, which has no Date data type, causing issues even in 2025.

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415. kragen+pD[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 01:45:34
>>bink+tl
Much more likely that SMIC would, because TI isn't just 15 years behind; it also has the disadvantage of being in the US. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semiconductor_industry_in_Chin... for a look at what it looks like where conditions are more favorable.
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418. colech+GD[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 01:48:09
>>adapte+fC
There's an option for the US to buy an additional 5% if Intel sells so it doesn't have majority ownership of its fabs.

But I think the real strings are a soft, private insistence that Intel won't be allowed to sell itself overseas.

The Defense Production Act and the Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States would be used to prevent the sale. The carrot is the whatever $18B in grants and investment, the stick is legislation that allows the government to prevent a sale.

https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/international/the-co...

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452. rayine+7I[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 02:29:05
>>sgnels+eE
Unfortunately, this ship sailed quite some time ago. For example, after the 2008 financial crisis, the Senate rejected a proposed bailout of GM. But Bush approved it anyway: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_the_2008%E2%80%9320...

> However, it had been argued that the Treasury lacked the statutory authority to direct TARP funds to the automakers, since TARP is limited to "financial institutions" under Section 102 of the TARP. It was also argued that providing TARP funds to automaker's financing operations, such as GMAC, runs counter to the intent of Congress for limiting TARP funds to true "financial institutions".[79] On December 19, 2008, President Bush used his executive authority to declare that TARP funds may be spent on any program he personally deems necessary to avert the financial crisis, and declared Section 102 to be nonbinding.

Also, “unitary executive” doesn’t mean overriding other branches. It just means that whatever powers the executive branch does or does not have are exercised by the President, just like the 535 members of Congress exercise all the powers of Congress, and the 9 Justices exercise all of the powers of the Supreme Court. It means that executive branch employees don’t have independent powers, just as House staffers and Supreme Court law clerks don’t have independent powers.

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federalist_No._70 (“Federalist No. 70 emphasizes the unitary structure of the executive. The strong executive must be unitary, Hamilton says, because ‘unity is conducive to energy...[d]ecision, activity, secrecy, and dispatch will generally characterize the proceedings of one man in a much more eminent degree than the proceedings of any greater number.’”).

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494. acomje+wN[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 03:24:06
>>cuttot+I4
All I can think here is the government forcing back doors

(like the failed Clipper chip) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clipper_chip

The thinking might be the government needs a local industry for security. Think submarine manufacturing. Not a huge private market for that, but best to keep local so the supply can’t be cut off.

Though usually the government isn’t the best stewards of companies. When I worked for a large government contractor someone joked “yesterday’s technology tomorrow”. Some of that is for reliability, but it wasn’t cutting edge in a lot of ways.

503. andsoi+dO[view] [source] 2025-08-23 03:30:43
>>giveme+(OP)
US Senator Bernie Sanders backs Trump plan for government stake in Intel — https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/2025/8/20/us-senator-berni...
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504. andsoi+iO[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 03:31:43
>>sgnels+eE
> is about the breakdown of the rule of law, a unitary executive bypassing all other branches of government and demanding a private enterprise give itself over to the government.

What do you think about Senator Bernie Sanders backing Trump plan for government stake in Intel?

https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/2025/8/20/us-senator-berni...

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507. beart+tO[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 03:33:13
>>andrew+VH
This link contains a graph of fab costs over time. It looks like 9 billion might get you a cutting edge fab 15-20 years ago. but that's just the fab.

https://semiwiki.com/forum/threads/how-to-build-a-20-billion...

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511. tbrown+OO[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 03:37:56
>>johnec+MC
The linked ppt here has a lot of details: https://fabweb.ece.illinois.edu/
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555. Beetle+lW[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 05:16:58
>>re-thc+8O
> So taking a scholarship means you're giving a % of yourself to the school?

> Was this ever mentioned when Intel signed up? Did you know about it?

See my other comment:

>>44993388

The main point is that even with the prior administration, it wasn't a given Intel would receive all the money. This way, they get the full amount, and fast.

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568. rayine+211[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 06:17:37
>>anon84+wS
The "unitary executive theory" is just a pejorative label for Article II, Section 1, Clause 1: "The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America." Alexander Hamilton talks about it in Federalist 70: "I rarely met with an intelligent man from any of the States, who did not admit, as the result of experience, that the UNITY of the executive of this State was one of the best of the distinguishing features of our constitution." (https://avalon.law.yale.edu/18th_century/fed70.asp).

Nobody called it a "theory" until FDR appointees ginned up a fourth branch of government in the 20th century. Then, they needed a label for what actually existed in the constitution to distinguish it from the shit they just made up. But most of the people who use the phrase "unitary executive theory" also think "emanations from penumbras" is constitutional law...

Also, the APA doesn't apply to the President, and it wouldn't be constitutional for it to do so.

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600. torgin+Nj1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 10:17:34
>>s1arti+jr
https://msadvisory.com/china-biggest-companies/

Look at this list - all the big ones here which are state owned are investment banks, petro companies and telcos.

Everyone else on the list (mainly internet companies, BYD, gaming, and B2C sales/distribution) is privately owned.

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614. rnrn+IA1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 13:36:38
>>anon29+yo
Are you sure congress didn’t authorize this ? i.e. actually specified that the money could only be used for grants and could not be used for equity purchases?

> The Department of Commerce is authorized to provide funding in various forms, including grants, cooperative agreements, loans, and loan guarantees, in exercising its Section 9902 authorities

https://www.congress.gov/crs-product/R47523

AFAICT the relevant section of law says it is up to the Secretary of Commerce to determine the funding type to be used for the semiconductor financial assistance

https://www.congress.gov/116/plaws/publ283/PLAW-116publ283.p...

See my other comment : >>44995799

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625. Cornbi+OE1[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 14:15:06
>>AlecSc+1o1
Exposing a US asset and getting his family kidnapped by the Taliban

https://www.propublica.org/article/doge-musk-mohammad-halimi...

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656. nozzle+S82[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-23 18:29:09
>>atkail+x62
At the risk of sounding a bit flippant, there's a popular 2018 headline from The Onion that becomes increasingly salient as time passes:

Trump Claims He Can Overrule Constitution With Executive Order Because Of Little-Known ‘No One Will Stop Me’ Loophole

https://theonion.com/trump-claims-he-can-overrule-constituti...

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686. Beetle+kU3[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-24 15:08:17
>>russel+eR2
> The funds were already going to Intel.

That's not a given - even under Biden: >>44993388

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694. SJC_Ha+Pc7[view] [source] [discussion] 2025-08-25 18:48:44
>>camdro+2o3
Here's Elbridge Colby on a debate about Ukraine and China

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMRYvl2Jefg

Hegseth on China

https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/41... https://edition.cnn.com/2025/03/27/asia/pete-hegseth-asia-to...

I don't think the views of all the "high level strategist" types align precisely. But there are very few true isolationists like Rand Paul in the executive branch

I find it doubtful that the current admin would just let China walk in to Taiwan. Trump doesn't want a war, but he's not going to want to get bent over and make the US look weak either.

And its not all that different from Democratic position, its a bit of "Washington Consensus" type of situation, like anti-Communism was during the Cold War. The approach between admins is slightly different however, and the Trump admin doesn't like Europe all that much.

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