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1. Andrew+(OP)[view] [source] 2024-12-28 12:48:28
> Oh help me! Oh, help me! My life is in danger!

> Oh help me! Oh, help me! My life is in danger!

> The venomous monster is drawing upon me

> And I can’t escape him.

> How near is his bite,

> With teeth sharp and white!

> Oh gods above!

> Why can’t you hear my mortal cry?

> Destroy the beast or I will die!

> Or surely, I will die!

The opening lines to The Magic Flute (which continues in a similarly expository tone for the duration). Seems like there have always been scripts which were easy to understand while also staring at your phone, though that doesn't stop the ushers at English National Opera getting narky at you if you try!

replies(5): >>cynica+e5 >>relaxi+g6 >>cco+TS >>TheOth+Ly1 >>_m_p+L35
2. cynica+e5[view] [source] 2024-12-28 13:48:22
>>Andrew+(OP)
Those lines are from a song, and a significant part of the audience at the time wouldn't be listening in their native language; it's not really a fair comparison.
replies(1): >>relaxi+v6
3. relaxi+g6[view] [source] 2024-12-28 13:58:46
>>Andrew+(OP)
Man. I like that you’re bringing opera into the conversation, but I don’t think comparing two different mediums that way is useful.

Die Zauberflote is easy to understand because it’s a fairly light work, and you’re meant to be staring at the lavish staging and costumes. The performers narrate the action because that’s the convention for the genre - it’s a sung story. They break into more conventional dialogue for the recitative sections (a tradition that went out of style with Verdi.)

replies(1): >>seabas+0n
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4. relaxi+v6[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-12-28 14:01:06
>>cynica+e5
? It was written in German for the German-speaking audience in Vienna.
replies(1): >>cynica+IF
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5. seabas+0n[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-12-28 16:29:25
>>relaxi+g6
> They break into more conventional dialogue for the recitative sections (a tradition that went out of style with Verdi.)

The comic operas of Gilbert and Sullivan were contemporary to Verdi's work and still feature lots of dialogue, so they are very approachable. You still won't be able to use your phone, though - you'll be too busy laughing!

My recommendation for an introduction would be the 1982 Canadian production of The Mikado by the Stratford Festival. It is currently available in its entirety on YouTube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbpUzCFCy_8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MK6y6n98O00

replies(1): >>relaxi+uL
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6. cynica+IF[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-12-28 18:36:54
>>relaxi+v6
Vienna was an international city; and Mozart and Shickhander were seeking international fame. The Magic Flute was a relatively low-brow 'singspiel' in the native language but its creators wanted foreigners to be able to see it and like it. (It was common for the wealthy and educated to speak many languages, not necessarily very well.) In music history you see critics criticize some operas for being difficult to understand, and remarking if the audience seemed lost.

International audiences nonwithstanding, it's just hard for many people to hear song lyrics, and a very common choice to make song lyrics simple, and hearing lyrics is critical for opera in a way it isn't if you're singing Goethe at a small salon concert.

The original point is it's silly to compare opera lyrics to spoken dialogue. Songs with belabored and repetitive lyrics can easily be interesting, spoken word with this property is banal.

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7. relaxi+uL[view] [source] [discussion] 2024-12-28 19:16:56
>>seabas+0n
Comic Operas are a different genre, for the most part you won’t find them in the repertory for the major world operas. Gilbert and Sullivan only overlapped with the end of Verdi’s career — they were very much a retrograde move in the artistic evolution of the medium.
8. cco+TS[view] [source] 2024-12-28 20:04:43
>>Andrew+(OP)
Really enjoy this curveball you threw, casts this whole conversation in a new light doesn't it?

It is true that a lot of old plays, operas etc do exactly what Netflix is accused of here. What is a monologue? Was Shakespeare guilty of creating casual viewing content when he wrote Hamlet's monologue? Shouldn't he have just showed Hamlet's ambivalence???

9. TheOth+Ly1[view] [source] 2024-12-29 01:47:08
>>Andrew+(OP)
In Mozart's time what was happening on the stage was a footnote to eating, talking, flirting, seeing, and being seen. Opera was a social event with background music.

Treating art with reverence and rapt attention didn't get to be a thing until the late Enlightenment. Before that the kind of art you took seriously was religious, and the idea that you were supposed to reverent about it could be considered a carry-over from religion.

Talking over things and not paying attention is almost the default. Sitting still and concentrating on a performance of any kind is a relatively recent idea.

None of this makes the crapification of Netflix (and related trends in other media touched by streaming and tech) any less annoying.

10. _m_p+L35[view] [source] 2024-12-30 15:32:45
>>Andrew+(OP)
Enough of this and you get a Wagner reinventing the medium altogether.
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