zlacker

>>vmoore+(OP)
I'm strongly in favor of expanding the US social safety net, but I don't want to neglect other obvious factors here. Dutch children are able to walk or bike outside unsupervised. In the US they'd risk either being killed by a driver, or stopped by an overzealous neighbor or police officer. I think this kind of freedom of movement has a big effect on happiness, it certainly did for me.

ETA relevant links: https://youtube.com/@NotJustBikes https://letgrow.org/

ETA again: I glibly mentioned "being killed by a driver" but of course navigating the typical US built environment if you're under 16 or otherwise unable to drive is a miserable experience in a number of ways even if you survive it. Highways make pedestrian paths unnecessarily roundabout. Parking lots make everything further from everything else. Crossing major roads requires getting drivers to notice and stop for you (harder when you're short!), or waiting through interminable signal cycles, etc.

>>MBlume+yj
> In the US they'd risk either being killed by a driver, or stopped by an overzealous neighbor or police officer.

It may depends on where in the US you're talking about, but in my area none of this is actually true. Although lots of people believe it is.

>>JohnFe+Kl
I find these stories of kids not walking (or biking) outside wild! Hundreds of kids in my neighborhood walk, bike, or public transit to school everyday with no issues.

I do worry about car on pedestrian crashes but the city has crossing guards and traffic calming for just this.

Where are these places that you can’t be outside as a child?

>>kasey_+1u
I'm not from the US, but just zoomed into a random spot in what I assume is a typical shopping district in suburban Atlanta[1]. Can't imagine many young kids safely walking or biking around there. Compare a local shopping district near me[2]. Plenty of young kids walking and biking to school here alone and in groups.

[1] https://www.google.co.nz/maps/@33.8644514,-84.5949946,3a,75y...

[2] https://www.google.co.nz/maps/@-41.2953813,174.7673872,3a,75...

edit: Might add that close to those shops in [2] there is a large botanic garden with play area and stream, one small and one very large reserve with native bush and an abundance of mountain bike tracks, a playing field, the central city area with cafes, many theatres, galleries, a library, and all sorts of other things that a child can make use of without supervision. All of this is within 5 minutes walk of those shops. Within 10 minutes walk there is the waterfront and a very safe swimming beach.

>>tmnvix+hC
But there are no schools or houses there?

I’m not arguing that there are places that are pedestrian unfriendly in the US or even that there are more places per capita like that in the US.

I’m just saying it would be weird for homes and schools to be placed in those locales, and even weirder for governmental officials to take action against kids walking in appropriate locales.

Here is the shopping district nearest me: https://maps.app.goo.gl/SUZCyUHuGbCAwcYT7?g_st=ic

And here is a place that is inappropriate for pedestrians near you https://maps.app.goo.gl/aLdDyWdbFq6vUG6X9?g_st=ic

Within 5 minutes of my area are at least 5 parks/play lots, a beach and a library.

Theaters, cafes and galleries are on that street.

Within 1 mile of that location is a 550 acre public park with all manner of facilities and less than 2 miles away is a 370 acre park.

Thats not mentioning the museums and university facilities near here.

None of that is to flex it’s just to say a random sampling is not an appropriate retort. The US can obviously be less car centric but to imply that it’s impossible or strange for kids to be outside on there own in the US is a wild assertion and anyone making it needs to provide extraordinary proof.