zlacker

[return to "Chess-GPT's Internal World Model"]
1. empora+IO1[view] [source] 2024-01-07 11:46:37
>>homarp+(OP)
Nice experiment, even though we know that LLMs distill an internal world model representation of whatever they are trained on.

The experiment could be a little better by using a more descriptive form of notation than PGN. PGN notation's strength is the shorthand properties of it, because it is used by humans while playing the game. That is far from being a strength as LLM training data. ML algorithms, and LLMs are trained better by feeding them more descriptive and accurate data, and verbosity is not a problem at all. There is the FEN notation in which in every move the entire board is encoded.

One could easily imagine many different ways to describe a game, like encoding vertical and horizontal lines, listing what exact squares each piece is covering, what color squares, which of the pieces are able to move, and in each move generate one whole page of the board situation.

I call this spatial navigation, in which the LLM learns the ins and outs of it's training data and it is able to make more informed guesses. Chess is fun and all, but code generation has the potential to be a lot better than just writing functions. By feeding the LLM the AST representation of the code, the tree of workspace files, public items, module hierarchy alongside with the code, it could be a significant improvement.

◧◩
2. gwern+bj2[view] [source] 2024-01-07 16:08:30
>>empora+IO1
> Nice experiment, even though we know that LLMs distill an internal world model representation of whatever they are trained on.

There are still a lot of people who deny that (for example Bender's "superintelligent octopus" supposedly wouldn't learn a world model, no matter how much text it trained on), so more evidence is always good.

> There is the FEN notation in which in every move the entire board is encoded.

The entire point of this is to not encode the board state!

◧◩◪
3. empora+rz2[view] [source] 2024-01-07 17:52:55
>>gwern+bj2
>The entire point of this is to not encode the board state!

I am not sure about this. From the article "The 50M parameter model played at 1300 ELO with 99.8% of its moves being legal within one day of training."

I thought that the experiment was how well the model will perform, given that it's reward function is to predict text, rather than checkmate. Leela, Alpha0 their reward function is to win the game, checkmate or capture pieces. Also it goes without saying that Leela, Alpha0 cannot make illegal moves.

The experiment does not need to include the whole board position if that's a problem, if that's an important point of interest. It could encode more information about squares covered by each side for example. See for example this training experiment for Trackmania [1]. There are techniques that the ML algorithm will *never* figure out by itself if this information is not encoded in it's training data.

The point still stands. PGN notation certainly is not a good format if the goal (or one of the goals) of the experiment is to be a good chess player.

[1]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dw3BZ6O_8LY

◧◩◪◨
4. gwern+ov3[view] [source] 2024-01-08 00:55:19
>>empora+rz2
That just shows that it worked in some sense. If it didn't reach any ELO, clearly the results would be uninformative: maybe it's impossible to learn chess from PGN, or maybe you just screwed up. He's clear that the point is to interrogate what it learns:

"This model is only trained to predict the next character in PGN strings (1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 …) and is never explicitly given the state of the board or the rules of chess. Despite this, in order to better predict the next character, it learns to compute the state of the board at any point of the game, and learns a diverse set of rules, including check, checkmate, castling, en passant, promotion, pinned pieces, etc. In addition, to better predict the next character it also learns to estimate latent variables such as the ELO rating of the players in the game."

[go to top]