zlacker

>>pera+(OP)
What really hurts Signal are two things:

* sub-par user experience: WhatsApp is just nicer and smoother, and people tend to like that

* very few people understand that Signal DOES NOT get your full contact list, while Facebook (through WhatsApp) does

Especially the second point is very relevant with the current situation — you do not necessarily want to expose your entire social graph to Facebook. But so few people understand this, and even fewer grasp that Signal can still work without doing the same thing.

>>jwr+ty
> Signal DOES NOT get your full contact list

The full contact list is uploaded to Signal servers by the phones. The only protection layer that users have is the questionable security of Intel's SGX.

It's still much better than what WhatsApp is doing, just not a black and white situation.

To add a point to your list: Signal does not have automatic cloud backup of messages, unlike WhatsApp. On WhatsApp, 30% of users have cloud backups enabled [1], meaning that you can basically assume that any reasonably sized group's messages can be accessed by people who have subpoena-power over Google (chance that there is no backup-enabled account in a group of n people is (1-0.3)^n... for 6 people it's already 12%).

[1]: https://telegra.ph/whatsapp-backdoor-01-16

>>est31+1D
Not the full contact list, just hashes.

That was exactly my point: few people know about this.

>>jwr+qH
Actually Signal is uploading contacts with their first and lastname to the cloud now. Or is planning to do so. Read their blog about that f-ing PIN feature. Its explained there. I hope they don’t go through with it, I absolutely do not wish to use some cloud; not even Signal’s. My data should be 100% local. And that they’re gonna push this without a back-up feature for iOS feels a bit like them raising their middle finger to us.