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[return to "How much do we need the police?"]
1. js2+G5[view] [source] 2020-06-03 22:33:48
>>js2+(OP)
I know folks don't always click through, so I'll highlight what I found most insightful:

> Part of our misunderstanding about the nature of policing is we keep imagining that we can turn police into social workers. That we can make them nice, friendly community outreach workers. But police are violence workers. That's what distinguishes them from all other government functions. ... They have the legal capacity to use violence in situations where the average citizen would be arrested.

> So when we turn a problem over to the police to manage, there will be violence, because those are ultimately the tools that they are most equipped to utilize: handcuffs, threats, guns, arrests. That's what really is at the root of policing. So if we don't want violence, we should try to figure out how to not get the police involved.

> Political protests are a threat to the order of this system. And so policing has always been the primary tool for managing those threats to the public order. Just as we understand the use of police to deal with homelessness as a political failure, every time we turn a political order problem over to the police to manage, that's also a political failure.

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2. clairi+a9[view] [source] 2020-06-03 22:53:59
>>js2+G5
we should convert 80% of cops with guns to investigators, and civics officers who teach civics and encourage civility in the communities in which they live. we don’t need that many cops with guns on the street, as there’s very little violent crime relatively speaking.
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3. Americ+2b[view] [source] 2020-06-03 23:03:45
>>clairi+a9
If you believed such a role was appropriate to establish in society, why on earth would you want the police doing it?
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4. usrusr+kd[view] [source] 2020-06-03 23:18:12
>>Americ+2b
You do need some people to be in charge of violence. If you make that their only job you'll be in a situation of hammers seeing nails wherever they look. You'll be much better off assigning that unavoidable violence duty to people whose main responsibilities and qualifications lie elsewhere.
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5. Americ+9e[view] [source] 2020-06-03 23:23:14
>>usrusr+kd
> If you make that their only job you'll be in a situation of hammers seeing nails wherever they look.

That depends entirely on how much power you give them, and how much accountability you impose upon their use of it. The primary role of police in society is to simply be the wide end of the funnel for the incarceration pipeline. Trying to give them duties that conflict with those objectives is simply always going to fail. Personally I wouldn’t want my children receiving civics instruction from somebody who has to hedge against the possibility that one day they’ll be trying to put them in jail.

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6. usrusr+Vs[view] [source] 2020-06-04 01:08:00
>>Americ+9e
No amount of power removal and accountability will change the "nails" perception if the only job they have is hammering.

> The primary role of police in society is to simply be the wide end of the funnel for the incarceration pipeline.

Only if your idea of a perfect society is one where everybody is incarcerated. I'd rather have one where as few people as possible need to be incarcerated to keep order.

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