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1. jasode+k2[view] [source] 2018-11-27 00:45:01
>>jashke+(OP)
Fyi... his post today seems to be related to a previous reddit post that HN also discussed: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15425632

(Downvoters: Did I read his essay incorrectly? The reddit post from 1 year ago and the github post today seem be the same theme of managing the community expectations of Cognitec.)

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2. gw+84[view] [source] 2018-11-27 01:02:56
>>jasode+k2
Broadly yes, but I'm guessing this one was sparked by this thread https://groups.google.com/d/msg/clojure/2GQQpxNcDlM/St3Can2x... and the indignation that spilled out elsewhere. We get these little brouhahas every couple months o_O

Rich put it well that Clojure is not closed, it is conservative. He made it to solve the problems he encountered in the industry, which were large multithreaded proprietary systems. It is a business first language (cognitect is a consultancy, after all). The fact that so many hobbyists like me ended up using it was kind of a happy accident.

These two audiences don't have completely opposed interests, but they do have different priorities. Businesses care about stability; they don't care much about whether the language accepts PRs on Github or conducts twitter polls. I accepted that a long time ago, and I'm still using it six years later.

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3. jasode+G5[view] [source] 2018-11-27 01:18:22
>>gw+84
>Broadly yes, but I'm guessing this one was sparked by this thread

Ok, I see the possible confusion. I wasn't trying to say they were related to the same event. I was trying to point out they were related themes.

When I read today's post, I had an immediate sense of déjà vu. No wonder, he used the word "entitlement" repeatedly in both posts a year apart. (Counted 11 times in today's post and 4 times in October 2017.) He also mentioned personal sacrifices of losing money on Clojure in both posts. (The "retirement money" in today's post and "$200k" in last year's post.)

I don't follow Clojure closely but the meta question/observation is that there seems to be a profoundly broken misunderstanding and recurring pattern of negative interaction between the Clojure community and Cognitec that causes Rich Hickey to express his frustration in way that other folks Ruby's Matz, Rust's Hoare, didn't have to express. (Maybe Hoare left years before the Rust community could turn on him and accuse Mozilla of holding back progress in the language (and therefore Rich's predicament is inevitable if one stays involved long enough) -- I dunno.)

Yes, different specific triggers but the same type of frustrated response. I thought they were over a year apart but you're saying the frustrations are unleashed every couple of months so that's news to me.

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4. sanxiy+n7[view] [source] 2018-11-27 01:38:35
>>jasode+G5
> Maybe Hoare left years before the Rust community could turn on him and accuse Mozilla of holding back progress in the language

Yes, this is the case. (As far as I can tell.)

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